Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)
Blow it out your ass, bob!
As usual, you are full of FUD!
==========================================
"Bob Miller" <robmx@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:YOdhc.3986$e4.1698@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...
:
: They are expensive because the manufacturers do not think there is a
big
: market for them. They do not see demand, retailers don't want to stock
: them and customers are not buying them.
:
: If manufacturers believed that the market was large they could ramp up
: production and achieve economies of scale. This only works so far
: however. 8-VSB has a limited market to begin with since only the US
and
: S. Korea are seriously doing 8-VSB and the broadcasters in S. Korea
are
: doing everything in their power to get their government to change
: modulations to COFDM. This kind of uncertainty and limited market
: opportunities make manufacturers cautious and limit he number of
: manufacturers that even want to get into the business of making 8-VSB
: receivers at any price.
:
: Therefore MOST set top box manufacturers have decided NOT to make
8-VSB
: receivers which also lets current ones making them keep their prices
high.
:
: It is not only economies of scale that make 8-VSB more expensive than
: other modulation receivers. 8-VSB is more expensive to produce
: intrinsically. Trying to solve multipath problems by brute force
: requires more silicon acreage hence higher cost.
:
: COFDM receiver cost start at $60 and COFDM DVB-T HD receivers would
: flood the US market at under $150 if this modulation was allowed in
the
: US. Why? Far lower royalty cost for one. IP royalties demanded by LG
: Industries for their monopoly position in the US are 10 times those
for
: COFDM. Those figures are around $6 for 8-VSB and 60 CENTS for COFDM.
: Manufactures take all cost including IP royalty cost and multiply by a
: factor of from 3 to 5 times so that extra $5.40 demanded by LG
: Industries cost you from $13.50 to $22.50 per receiver.
:
: Then there is the economies of scale. COFDM is the world standard and
is
: being implemented in most other countries of the world. Knowing that
: they can sell their products to a world market emboldens manufacturers
: to build in large quantities which radically lowers cost.
:
: More competition. Most set top box manufacturers are making or will
soon
: make COFDM receivers of many kinds that work with analog and digital
TV
: sets, PDA's, lap top computers, cell phones, portable TV sets and in
car
: receivers. This stiff competition for many large and new markets
forces
: the myriad of competitors to keep prices as low as possible.
:
: It is not just the cost of the receiver that the manufacturer has to
: consider. They know that the customer will have to buy and install a
: rooftop antenna with rotor in most cases which is part of the total
cost
: the buyer is facing which lowers demand still further since COFDM does
: not require such rotorized antenna. Also the retailer worries about
: returns and problems with reception that will cut into or eliminate
any
: profit he might make so they emphasize the HDTV set and not the
receiver
: when selling. Result, 9 out of 10 HDTV buyers don't buy an OTA
receiver.
: Even though we know there is more HD content OTA than on cable or sat
: and its free.
:
: Not true with COFDM receivers which work plug and play with simple
: indoor antennas so the cost of the receiver is the total cost.
:
: So you have few manufacturers making a more expensive receiver for a
: smaller market (the US and S. Korea) and fewer markets (no mobile or
: portable).
:
:
:
:
: George Thorogood wrote:
: > On Mon, 19 Apr 2004 23:21:43 -0400, "Curmudgeon" <gary@nospam.com>
wrote:
: >
: >
: >>They're that expensive because people will pay that much for them.
Just
: >>like DVD players used to be $500.
: >>
: >>They'll be commodity cheapo boxes long before 2007/
: >
: >
: > Hey. Thanks for the response. Yeah, I remember those days. But I
have
: > never understood that kind of economics. If the cheapest is $300
regularly,
: > I think they would sell a great deal more than 3 times more units at
$100.
: > And thus make more money, which is the whole point. For example, I
(and
: > two other guys I know) want an ota receiver. But I am not paying
$300 for
: > one. If I could get one for $100, that is acceptable. Guess I will
just
: > have to wait and keep an eye out for deals.
: >
Blow it out your ass, bob!
As usual, you are full of FUD!
==========================================
"Bob Miller" <robmx@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:YOdhc.3986$e4.1698@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...
:
: They are expensive because the manufacturers do not think there is a
big
: market for them. They do not see demand, retailers don't want to stock
: them and customers are not buying them.
:
: If manufacturers believed that the market was large they could ramp up
: production and achieve economies of scale. This only works so far
: however. 8-VSB has a limited market to begin with since only the US
and
: S. Korea are seriously doing 8-VSB and the broadcasters in S. Korea
are
: doing everything in their power to get their government to change
: modulations to COFDM. This kind of uncertainty and limited market
: opportunities make manufacturers cautious and limit he number of
: manufacturers that even want to get into the business of making 8-VSB
: receivers at any price.
:
: Therefore MOST set top box manufacturers have decided NOT to make
8-VSB
: receivers which also lets current ones making them keep their prices
high.
:
: It is not only economies of scale that make 8-VSB more expensive than
: other modulation receivers. 8-VSB is more expensive to produce
: intrinsically. Trying to solve multipath problems by brute force
: requires more silicon acreage hence higher cost.
:
: COFDM receiver cost start at $60 and COFDM DVB-T HD receivers would
: flood the US market at under $150 if this modulation was allowed in
the
: US. Why? Far lower royalty cost for one. IP royalties demanded by LG
: Industries for their monopoly position in the US are 10 times those
for
: COFDM. Those figures are around $6 for 8-VSB and 60 CENTS for COFDM.
: Manufactures take all cost including IP royalty cost and multiply by a
: factor of from 3 to 5 times so that extra $5.40 demanded by LG
: Industries cost you from $13.50 to $22.50 per receiver.
:
: Then there is the economies of scale. COFDM is the world standard and
is
: being implemented in most other countries of the world. Knowing that
: they can sell their products to a world market emboldens manufacturers
: to build in large quantities which radically lowers cost.
:
: More competition. Most set top box manufacturers are making or will
soon
: make COFDM receivers of many kinds that work with analog and digital
TV
: sets, PDA's, lap top computers, cell phones, portable TV sets and in
car
: receivers. This stiff competition for many large and new markets
forces
: the myriad of competitors to keep prices as low as possible.
:
: It is not just the cost of the receiver that the manufacturer has to
: consider. They know that the customer will have to buy and install a
: rooftop antenna with rotor in most cases which is part of the total
cost
: the buyer is facing which lowers demand still further since COFDM does
: not require such rotorized antenna. Also the retailer worries about
: returns and problems with reception that will cut into or eliminate
any
: profit he might make so they emphasize the HDTV set and not the
receiver
: when selling. Result, 9 out of 10 HDTV buyers don't buy an OTA
receiver.
: Even though we know there is more HD content OTA than on cable or sat
: and its free.
:
: Not true with COFDM receivers which work plug and play with simple
: indoor antennas so the cost of the receiver is the total cost.
:
: So you have few manufacturers making a more expensive receiver for a
: smaller market (the US and S. Korea) and fewer markets (no mobile or
: portable).
:
:
:
:
: George Thorogood wrote:
: > On Mon, 19 Apr 2004 23:21:43 -0400, "Curmudgeon" <gary@nospam.com>
wrote:
: >
: >
: >>They're that expensive because people will pay that much for them.
Just
: >>like DVD players used to be $500.
: >>
: >>They'll be commodity cheapo boxes long before 2007/
: >
: >
: > Hey. Thanks for the response. Yeah, I remember those days. But I
have
: > never understood that kind of economics. If the cheapest is $300
regularly,
: > I think they would sell a great deal more than 3 times more units at
$100.
: > And thus make more money, which is the whole point. For example, I
(and
: > two other guys I know) want an ota receiver. But I am not paying
$300 for
: > one. If I could get one for $100, that is acceptable. Guess I will
just
: > have to wait and keep an eye out for deals.
: >
/news.com.com/2100-1037-5195961.html?tag=nefd.hed
.
/www.nabs.net/Cartoons/OverTheHedge/AmericaOnline.gif
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