Skype Multitasks on iPhone; Voice Plans Useless

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watcha

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'Rubbish, if I have to actually think about how I hold my phone then something is wrong'

'It does happen when you hold the phone normally, particularly if you are left handed'

Actually, you don't have to think about it. That's my point. Holding it normally (for me, as a right hander) doesn't cause any problems. And even if you do touch the dodgy bit, the calls still don't get dropped. As Anandtech said, the low signal call retention on the IPhone is unrivalled.

 

watcha

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'There's trying to make money and then there's ripping people off..'

The value of any item is driven by the normal rules of supply and demand. Even at the prices that you claim are 'ripping people off', Apple can't produce as many as they sold. Obviously the market values the phone higher than you do. And it's the markets decision to make.
 

watcha

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'Well, issue with that statement, Apple is NOT a phone company. They are a technology company which also builds smart phones.'

I think arguing about whether we class a company who produces phones as a phone company or not is a bit irrelevant. My point still stands even if Apples primary goal was to produce cheese. As it happens, the technology world agrees with my obvious assessment that any company which produces phones is a phone company. Pretty much any company which produces phones also produces other items, it doesn't mean they aren't a phone company.

Please see following link:
http://gizmodo.com/5528156/apples-now-the-biggest-phone-company-in-the-us

'So, no, they are not a phone company.'

Er, yes, they are a phone company. And it wouldn't matter if they weren't

'And if it was not for the app store (prime example of nickle and dimeing (granted android does this as well)).'

If it wasn't for the app store.... what?

'However with apple, you need to jailbreak the phone, which voids the warranty to be able to bypass the app store.'

Sorry, remind me: why do we want to bypass the biggest app store in the world again?

I actually still don't know what point you're trying to make?
 

guzz46

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Actually, you don't have to think about it. That's my point. Holding it normally (for me, as a right hander) doesn't cause any problems. And even if you do touch the dodgy bit, the calls still don't get dropped. As Anandtech said, the low signal call retention on the IPhone is unrivalled.
So apple have made a phone for right handed people only? and low signal call retention is unrivalled compared to what? the iphone 3g?
 

watcha

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'So apple have made a phone for right handed people only? and low signal call retention is unrivalled compared to what? the iphone 3g?'

No, they made a phone which has a MINOR bug for JUST left handers (which is a minority already).

Then, of that minority, the majority don't see any dropped calls or signals (the phone can hold calls right down to -120db).

Then, of that minority of the minority who actually see calls dropped, the majority wanted a case anyway, to protect the phone.

So yes, they made a phone which the minority of a minority of a minority may have problems with if they hold it in the wrong place, don't want a case, have a very weak signal to start with. And those people can return it for a free refund. And the other 99.5% can just use the phone as normal.

'Compared to what' - Well, in the article they compare it to the IPhone 3G, yes (which had no signal issues, so it's a valid comparison) but if you can find me another phone (and evidence) which can hold on to calls at -113 db then I'm all ears.

'I've never held onto so many calls and data simultaneously on 1 bar at -113 dBm as I have with the iPhone 4'
Anandtech
 

Griffolion

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A number of people have said that iPhone users look down on non-iPhone users. I have an X10 (Android) and look down on all the iPhone users. They claim to have "seen the light" technologically, well light can blind you know..
 

watcha

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& I forgot to mention, a lot of left handers still don't hold the phone in a way which compromises the signal, so another minority there.
 

watcha

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'A number of people have said that iPhone users look down on non-iPhone users. I have an X10 (Android) and look down on all the iPhone users. They claim to have "seen the light" technologically, well light can blind you know.'

What can the Android do - in terms of actual features (ie Apps) which the IPhone can't? I think you can be blinded by reading numbers instead of appreciating the other things.

I'm in the market for a mobile phone at the moment, and in the past I've gone for phones which have the best hardware specs on paper and good reviews, but I've always been burned - they consistently suck. The user interface is awful, the performance doesn't match the hardware, and the lack of apps is frustrating. I am considering an IPhone4, it means I can watch Sky Sports while I'm out somewhere, for example. It does have a better screen, it does have better battery life, it is very fast in terms of the user interface, none of the sluggishness which other phones have, and it does have better transfer / network speeds than most other phones. Couple that with the ever-increasing number of Apps which do very real useful tasks (such as my example , which you can't get on Android), and where is the disadvantage?

I don't own any Apple products, but I have to say that the IPhone4 just looks to be the best, on paper. Even people like customer reviews have said that it's the best phone (despite not being able to recommend it). As a right handed user who would probably use a case and has excellent signal strength anyway, and as someone who has the intelligence to not hold the phone in a way to deliberately reduce the signal, I don't see any problem with it? It doesn't seem to miss out on anything other phones have.

Talking about 'open source' is all very nice and good in theory, but in practise, who cares? If I don't need it to be open source to do everything I want, what's the benefit?

And I'm genuinely asking by the way, I haven't made a decision yet :-D
 

guzz46

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No, they made a phone which has a MINOR bug for JUST left handers (which is a minority already).
They actually made a phone that has a design flaw regarding the antenna, it effects every iphone 4, whether or not you drop a call depends on the signal quality in your area.

And i do recall people complaining about iphone 3g reception problems also, so comparing it to the 3g is not really saying much. I have a nokia n82 and i have been in some pretty remote locations with no signal problems, i would to love to show you some evidence but they only seem to do these analysts on phones that actually have reception problems.
 

watcha

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'They actually made a phone that has a design flaw regarding the antenna, it effects every iphone 4, whether or not you drop a call depends on the signal quality in your area.'

I didn't deny there is a minor design flaw, my point is that it only affects the phone if you happen to hold it in that exact place. The majority of users don't. And even if they do, they probably wont drop the call. And even if they have weak signal AND hold it in a specific way, they probably have a case. So aren't affected. It's a tiny minority of people who are affected by this 'design flaw'.

Regarding the Nokia N82 - you're right I don't think there's too much data on that phone, they only seem to do analysis on the big-selling popular phones. I know the Anandtech article said he travelled all over into remote locations and had no problems though. I guess neither of us can compare until we see the data side by side, but I certainly don't think there's a problem with signal at all unless all of the conditions are applied, ie: Holding in very specific way, no case, and weak signal.

They just don't apply to many people.
 

guzz46

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It doesn't seem to miss out on anything other phones have.
Just off the top of my head how about no memory card slot, no user replacable battery, no java support, no flash support, no built in radio, no fm transmitter, no video calling over 3g
 

watcha

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No memory card slot - This seems to be a valid one, but I can just synchronise files using apps such as Dropbox, so I don't need to store everything on the phone. 64GB is more than enough for my needs.
No user replacable battery - I've never replaced any battery on any mobile phone.
No java support - Why do I need java?
No flash support - There are various apps to allow flash to work
No built in radio - There are hundreds of radio apps
No fm transmitter - Why do I need an fm transmitter?
No video calling over 3g - Various apps, such as Fring allow this.
 

guzz46

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I didn't deny there is a minor design flaw, my point is that it only affects the phone if you happen to hold it in that exact place. The majority of users don't. And even if they do, they probably wont drop the call. And even if they have weak signal AND hold it in a specific way, they probably have a case. So aren't affected. It's a tiny minority of people who are affected by this 'design flaw'.
Its probably a major design flaw for the people that are having problems with it, but its still a design flaw none the less. I am right handed and happen to touch the bottom left of my phone when making a call.
 

guzz46

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No memory card slot - This seems to be a valid one, but I can just synchronise files using apps such as Dropbox, so I don't need to store everything on the phone. 64GB is more than enough for my needs.
No user replacable battery - I've never replaced any battery on any mobile phone.
No java support - Why do I need java?
No flash support - There are various apps to allow flash to work
No built in radio - There are hundreds of radio apps
No fm transmitter - Why do I need an fm transmitter?
No video calling over 3g - Various apps, such as Fring allow this.
You said "It doesn't seem to miss out on anything other phones have" and i gave a list that showed it does, whether you need those features or not is up to you, i can think of plenty of reasons why i would like those features
 

watcha

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'Its probably a major design flaw for the people that are having problems with it, but its still a design flaw none the less. I am right handed and happen to touch the bottom left of my phone when making a call.'

This doesn't address my point - ie that not many people are affected. I already agreed that it's a design flaw. It just doesn't affect many people. Touching the bottom left is not enough, you have to 1 - Touch the bottom left in such a way to bridge the gap (very different) 2 - Have a weak signal in the first place and 3 - Not have a case (which is free).

Even then, you probably wont drop the calls, you'll just see lower signal.

Sure, it's an issue - but it's a tiny minority who are affected. The return rate for the IPhone4 is incredibly low (0.5%).
 

watcha

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'i can think of plenty of reasons why i would like those features'

Can you tell me some of them please? :) I think the Radio & Calling over 3G points are wrong because of apps - so you can do those. Battery replacement can be done via Apple.

This leaves Java, flash, and an FM transmitter. Can you let me know what you need them for? Again, please don't take offence - I just want to make sure it's nothing I need :)
 

gregor

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"What can the Android do - in terms of actual features (ie Apps) which the IPhone can't? I think you can be blinded by reading numbers instead of appreciating the other things."

I think of it the other way, what can an iPhone do for me that my Desire cant, for a vastly cheaper price?

Implying that people who do actually touch the bottom of their phone are retards is a bit unfair to be honest.
I'm right handed, but I often hold the phone in my left hand, so judging by how I hold my phone now, if I held it in my left then I guess my palm would bridge the gap. If I held it (without thinking about it) in my right hand then there's a fair chance that either my ring finger or little finger could bridge the gap.
 

guzz46

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Ok i carry a spare battery with me so if i'm away from a power point for a number of days or if i head out for a mountain bike ride and my battery runs out i can swap them out.

I am on prepaid and use a java app that allows me to send text messages for 2 cents each, plus having the option to install any other java app is useful.

An FM transmitter is handy if you want to play your music collection (stored on your phone) on a home or car stereo and you don't have your cable on you or if your car stereo doesn't have AUX inputs. Plus if your mates are driving behind you they should be able to tune in and listen also.

Flash is all over the web and some websites don't work if you don't have flash enabled

 

watcha

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'I think of it the other way, what can an iPhone do for me that my Desire cant, for a vastly cheaper price?'

There's hundreds. Lets use the example of the Sky Sports app. If I get an IPhone, I can be out and about and watch live football. There are hundreds of apps like this which only exist on the IPhone. There are loads of big corporations who only make mobile apps for the IPhone, because it's the biggest market. I can't do that on other phones. I also have longer battery life, better screen, faster user interface, good transfer speeds. I also think it looks better (And yes of course this is a matter of opinion, but if you want something more it only has to match other phones in terms of capabilities).

'Implying that people who do actually touch the bottom of their phone are retards is a bit unfair to be honest.'

Oh come on, that isn't quite what I said, but it's pretty much true. If you know that when you hold your phone in a certain place, the signal drops, it doesn't take much to just change your grip slightly. It's just common sense. And that's only relevant to the tiny percentage who naturally touch it in exactly the same spot. Like I said, the majority have strong enough signal anyway to not be affected, or have cases. If they actually do have a serious problem, in that their natural grip causes signal loss because they have weak signal and no case, then they should take it back. That's all I said, and it's just common sense IMO.
 

watcha

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Thanks guzz46

'Ok i carry a spare battery with me so if i'm away from a power point for a number of days or if i head out for a mountain bike ride and my battery runs out i can swap them out.'

I think this is resolved by the IPhone - it can last for 300 hours on Standby (over 12 days). Also, if you're carrying around a spare battery, you could just as easily carry a charger for the IPhone (with inbuilt battery). Both require you to purchase additional hardware so I guess it's the same.

'I am on prepaid and use a java app that allows me to send text messages for 2 cents each, plus having the option to install any other java app is useful.'

Ah OK, see, I don't send text messages any more. I think if I did send text messages, I'd use TextPlus, an Iphone app which lets you send text messages for free. I guess that's my point really, any apps which you may have which are java, most likely have an equivalent in the App Store.

'An FM transmitter is handy if you want to play your music collection (stored on your phone) on a home or car stereo and you don't have your cable on you or if your car stereo doesn't have AUX inputs. Plus if your mates are driving behind you they should be able to tune in and listen also.'

OK, thanks for this. I think that I don't need to do that. I know there are apps which let you synchronise music onto networks etc so I could do it like that, or I could buy an FM transmitter for $10. I usually have the cables handy anyway, or a cradle in the car/home - but thanks, I've never used an FM transmitter.

'Flash is all over the web and some websites don't work if you don't have flash enabled'

Yeah, true, but a lot of the major ones such as Youtube have apps, or mobile versions which don't use flash. It's fair to say that there will always be some which use flash though, and it's fair to say that's a disadvantage of the IPhone. I had flash support on my old phone and it just took forever to load and then didn't behave as it would on a normal PC, so I think that's a compromise I'm willing to make.

Thanks for all your points though - very interesting :)
 
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