The Cost Of The Smart Grid: $476 Billion

[tank]

Memadmax sorry to say but you should do your own research as well.

http/en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smart_grid

I know wiki is open source but at least they seem to know what a "smart grid" is.

 

[shin0bi272]

I remember a quote from nanny nancy pelosi a few years ago when they announced this debacle was going to come about. She said that it was important to have it because that way we can monitor your energy usage and see who is using too much. Too much for who? the government? when did it become their concern how much electricity I use? I pay my bill every month and screw them for wanting to tax me or jail me for using more than THEY allow! I thought the greenies were discredited... why are we still allowing this stupid idea to go forward?

 

[nebun]

[citation][nom]the associate[/nom]That's why you don't run things, your not heavily influenced by greed and believe in progress for humanity. We've had the means to create free electricity for quite some time now, but they keep it under the rug basically. Why? Cause their stupid to realize that making us pay the same as tax dollars will make them richer and benefit everyone anyways.[/citation]
free electricity is very expensive because our politicians make it that way...why do you think that we pay so much more for a gallon for diesel?...our so called government is not very smart, and they think that diesel is more dirty...it's a lie, about 80% of the cars sold all over the world are diesel cars. Europe has one of the most stringent pollution laws and they seem to make it work...like i said it's all about politics and it's very sad

 

[Guest]

I am not sure if 3 trillion is a number i would trust. EPRI is an organization that work for Utilities (though they claim independent status). Everyone is out to make a buck at the cost of the customer

 

[cyb34]

Why should society pay for upgrades that only affect your business's profit?

Your business should invest in infrastructure and development, not society.

Society will invest in things that BELONG to the society, not things that can disappear overnight.

 

[Guest]

The longer we wait ... the more it will cost.

As with petrol, it's the 'middle-men' power-marketeers who need to be squeezed as they incur none of the up-front capital costs but will move substantial power regionally for peak loads.

And if you don't like the gov't, go live in Somalia.

I didn't hear any of you clowns bitchin' about Federal dollars 10 years ago when two major tax cuts, two major wars, a Big Pharma Drug Give-A-Way and NCLM were put on Uncle Sam's Credit Card.

That bill has come due -- deal with it in a reasonable fashion or get out of the way and let the adults handle it.

 

[back_by_demand]

Simple maths, gotta love it

$476 billion to build it, $2 trillion in benefits.

So the power company pays for all the work to be done with no increase in bills for the consumer.

Then when the benefits kick in to the tune of $1.5 trillion they can keep it all.

If however they expect bill payers to front extra money, it is only fitting that the benefits of $1.5 trillion are kicked back to the bill payers in terms of lower bills.

Deal?

 

[wiyosaya]

[citation][nom]memadmax[/nom]Point being: The system works.[/citation]I wonder what the NE blackout from a few years back was. In your opinion, was this another case of "the system working?"

 

[back_by_demand]

[citation][nom]wiyosaya[/nom]I wonder what the NE blackout from a few years back was. In your opinion, was this another case of "the system working?"[/citation]
The NE blackout was discussed above, ad nauseum, so why mention it again?

 

[grieve]

Only $476 Billion ? I will take two please.

 

[grieve]

[citation][nom]back_by_demand[/nom]Simple maths, gotta love it$476 billion to build it, $2 trillion in benefits.So the power company pays for all the work to be done with no increase in bills for the consumer.Then when the benefits kick in to the tune of $1.5 trillion they can keep it all.If however they expect bill payers to front extra money, it is only fitting that the benefits of $1.5 trillion are kicked back to the bill payers in terms of lower bills.Deal?[/citation]
I agree. This would never happen but you are totaly right!

 

[f-14]

476 billion to do something they already know or can do ever since analog.
hello a new name for off peak or power cut off on demand. off peak is great it throttles your power useage to select high power consuming devices ( waterheaters, air conditioning, electric furnaces) it's also great at burning out your light bulbs, electronics when they issue the kill command that starts undervolting and throttling your usage.
this is a benefit only for big businesses who do not sign up for it. much like daylight savings time, it saves your employers money on electricity for lighting as you are the one having to be in the dark hours using electricty that you have to pay for instead of them. that also has a huge impact on your health as your daylight hours are cut down in the spring and fall and people tend not to go outside and exercise when it's dark out and plop down infront of a t/v instead. studies have proven this.
memadmax is dead on right, it's basically a system for business designed by business to benefit at societies expense. i can't wait for you guys to start noticing your computers burning up and your new tv's burning up or going dim along with your lights every time it kicks in
you're really going to enjoy only being able to cook in your oven or wash your clothes in the middle of the night when it's convienent for big businesses not sucking up all the electricty and the power plants having excess power going to waste. i'm going to laugh when you get to the best part of your show on your day off from work when the a/c cuts off and they shut off power to your home in the middle of your favorite show or movie and it's raining out.
how smart will your smart grid be then?
that's exactly what the smart grid is all about. anybody with off peak can tell you how many light bulbs they replace every year due to the dimming.
you love microsofts security right? your going to love hackers being able to do things like turn power and lights in whole neighborhoods or states for a nice air plane ride their significant other is taking while going over you so they can send a message in home or street lights how much they love each other.
hell i'd be happy just to be able to shut your power off in mid game before you could shoot me in COD
you laugh now, but this is what will be possible once it's completed. i'm just glad it will be a long while before skynet comes around after it's done, i'd settle for some dumb hacker every one will be able to put 2 between his eyes.
and if you think i'm kidding or this is a joke i have built the very infrastructure you're using and what i haven't i can say either my father and uncles their cousins or grand fathers and great uncles have from sea to shinning sea and the gulf. the gregory b. jarvis damn in hinkley new york to the matamorous to houston transmission line to the wind turbine farm in the dakota's and the trasmission line carrying it to the nuclear plant in monticello and the sherco plant in becker next to my parents house.
i know more about this smart grid then most snots on here proclaiming me and memadmax don't know what we are talking about. unlike you guys i actually get to talk to the planners and operators and line men who use what i've helped build for them. what i don't know i can go next door to a bunch of guys managing & operating it or the community where it's being built and ask them. i don't really need to since a peice of it is being built practically in my back yard.
as i'm already apart of the smart grid i'm telling you how it actually works, right now today, and what i'm told by the people who are flicking the switches how it works now and will work in the future.
+1 to memadmax don't bother responding to the snerts, let them find out the hard way, i don't care if they find being throttled and cut off for using too much power. i know me and you will have a home generator system and not care. i already do thanks to the mighty mississippi and a pet science project of mine from high school. thanks to an old power production law NSP/Excel actually pay me .17 for extra kwh's and if i ever decided to upgrade my gene i qualify for a federal grant for the amount of excess i have produced since then hydro electric ftw! ( i built this back in the 85-89 drought ) ty to any one from niagra mohawk and the tennessee river valley authority for the inspiration.

 

[milktea]

My understanding of a smart grid is that it incorporates "two-way" communication between the home user and the utility company using new digital transmission technique. But my question is, why would the utility need to know what appliances I'm using? Why would they need to know how much kW I'm burning down to the hour or minutes accuracy?
My prediction with the new smart grid is that every home appliances would have a built in RF devices that handles all the data transmission. That way, the utility would be able to track down what equipment you're using, and when you're using it. I certainly don't want that. That's an invasion of privacy.

... my 2 cents

 

[PhilFrisbie]

[citation][nom]milktea[/nom] Why would they need to know how much kW I'm burning down to the hour or minutes accuracy?[/citation]
Because they want to be able to charge home and ordinary business users the same way they already charge large industrial users: by the hour. You will pay much more for power used during the day than that used during the night. By encouraging home users to shift power usage from day to night they can run their power plants more efficiently and avoid building so many new plants.

Of course the utilities say that the average user will pay LESS for power, but I will believe it when I see it!