Chevy Volt Grabs 230 MPG Rating, With Catches

[mooh_06]

as8df7h2js8222

thanx very much that was a very easy way of explaining it.

i was thinking the same way as Jerther

 

[geoffs]

I think a better way to measure car efficiency is to do miles per energy consumed in Joules or KJ.

Efficiency, yes, but since we don't buy fuel by it's energy rating and the cost per KJ varies dramatically between fuel/energy sources, and because the energy density varies dramatically between fuels, etc., it's a useless number to the consumer.

Estimated cost per 1000 miles (per 1000 KM for most of the world) is far more useful to the buyer. This gives easy access to estimating monthly energy/fuel costs.

Then, you can add a vehicle pollution index that is based upon energy efficiency and the fuel/energy source. Pollution index should be calculated for the vehicle from the "pump"/charging outlet, perhaps in kJ/mi (kJ/km). You can add a separate pollution index for the fuel/energy source that estimates the pollution created during production & distribution of that fuel/energy source, expressed in "pollution units"/kJ. Multiply the pollution index of the fuel/energy at the point of distribution times the vehicle pollution index and you get "pollution units" per mi (or km).

The hardest part of that is agreeing on the "pollution units" because not all pollutants are equally harmful. Still, it would give easy access to estimating how "green" a given vehicle is using any of it's available energy/fuel sources. You could choose to buy the cheapest fuel/energy, or the least polluting source depending upon what's more important to you. For instance, an EV owner might choose to buy more expensive electricity from a 100% renewable source, or just buy what's cheapest knowing the efficiency of the EV and centralized electricity generation is less polluting than a gasoline powered vehicle. You might even change your priorities from time to time during the life of the vehicle.

 

[IzzyCraft]

[citation][nom]falchard[/nom]Gas is cheaper then electricity. Curbing a $200/month fuel charge for a $400/month electricity charge is a little dumb.[/citation]
If that was true then we would be running our houses on gas generators...

 

[cdillon]

[citation][nom]falchard[/nom]Gas is cheaper then electricity. Curbing a $200/month fuel charge for a $400/month electricity charge is a little dumb.[/citation]

That has to be one of the most ignorant statements I've seen on here yet. An electric car will cost you about half as much money per-mile than a 50-MPG gas-only car. In other words, a 100MPG gas-only car would just about break even with the cost of recharging an electric car, but gas-only cars with that kind of mileage do not exist and may never exist, and if they did I don't think they'd be very fun to drive. Electric cars (or hybrids) will give you extremely good cost-per-mile and can still have plenty of get-up-and-go power.

 

[rooket]

Heh i get -2 for stating that it costs money to charge the battery? Are you guys kidding me? You think it is free, then fine. Go have fun spending 40 grand on a POS chevrolet and driving it with elves and fairies giving it power.

 

[worst3]

keep in mind this is city mpg not highway. the car will get most of the energy back when it stops and not lose a lot to drag. and most people do not drive that far in the city (unless your a taxi). high way millage will be lower and harder to calculate as after the first 40 miles it is electric. also the first 40 i believe is given by calculating by a gas equivalent energy out put.

 

[worst3]

keep in mind this is city mpg not highway. the car will get most of the energy back when it stops and not lose a lot to drag. and most people do not drive that far in the city (unless your a taxi). high way millage will be lower and harder to calculate as after the first 40 miles it is electric. also the first 40 i believe is given by calculating by a gas equivalent energy out put.

 

[cdillon]

[citation][nom]rooket[/nom]Heh i get -2 for stating that it costs money to charge the battery? Are you guys kidding me? You think it is free, then fine. Go have fun spending 40 grand on a POS chevrolet and driving it with elves and fairies giving it power.[/citation]

You likely got marked down because they didn't "leave the utility bill out of the equation". The cost of the electricity is figured in to the EPA's MPG ratings for electric cars. That's why it is "230 MPG" instead of "Infinity MPG". The numbers are there to tell you it will cost you the same amount of money to drive this "230 MPG" electric car as it would to drive a "230 MPG" gas-only car. I think "230 MPG" may be a bit on the high side, but the point is they're trying to give you a comparison.

 

[bydesign]

If you are to believe GM then it cost about $.90 to go 100 miles. At least that what it would cost me. Sounds great until you factor in that it's gas only counter parts run around $20k-25k. So this has nothing to do with saving money and only useful for tree huggers trying to make a point.

 

[bydesign]

If you are to believe GM then it cost about $.90 to go 100 miles. At least that what it would cost me. Sounds great until you factor in that it's gas only counter parts run around $20k-25k. So this has nothing to do with saving money and only useful for tree huggers trying to make a point.

 

[jacobdrj]

[citation][nom]ByDesign[/nom]If you are to believe GM then it cost about $.90 to go 100 miles. At least that what it would cost me. Sounds great until you factor in that it's gas only counter parts run around $20k-25k. So this has nothing to do with saving money and only useful for tree huggers trying to make a point.[/citation]
It starts with 'tree huggers' in this case, early adopters. They cheapen it down for the rest of us. It is a 'proof of concept' and at least an attempt by a major auto company to try coping with the inevitable increase in energy costs over the next 25 years.

 

[kingssman]

Ugg no matter how much MPG this car gets, it's priced at a sports car and you can probably buy 2 clunky SUVs for the cost of the Volt

 

[geoffs]

You likely got marked down because they didn't "leave the utility bill out of the equation". The cost of the electricity is figured in to the EPA's MPG ratings for electric cars. That's why it is "230 MPG" instead of "Infinity MPG". The numbers are there to tell you it will cost you the same amount of money to drive this "230 MPG" electric car as it would to drive a "230 MPG" gas-only car. I think "230 MPG" may be a bit on the high side, but the point is they're trying to give you a comparison.

Incorrect. For the Volt, the current electric cost per mile is about 45% of the cost of gasoline per mile, so if you're using price of electricity vs price of gas on the volt, the Volt gets about 50MPG on gas and the same $2.70 would get you about 110 miles. 230MPG is based upon completely ignoring the cost of electricity and driving 80+% on of miles on battery only.

 

[pocketdrummer]

They should average this per a FULL TANK OF GAS! That will be more accurate. Having special circumstances will make the mpg rating total BS.

It's kind of like buying speakers......

(Oh, this speaker can output 20Hz to 20KHz? Really? And what exactly does the frequency response chart look like? Probably a question mark...... stupid marketing schemes.)

 

[pocketdrummer]

[citation][nom]cdillon[/nom]You likely got marked down because they didn't "leave the utility bill out of the equation". The cost of the electricity is figured in to the EPA's MPG ratings for electric cars. That's why it is "230 MPG" instead of "Infinity MPG". The numbers are there to tell you it will cost you the same amount of money to drive this "230 MPG" electric car as it would to drive a "230 MPG" gas-only car. I think "230 MPG" may be a bit on the high side, but the point is they're trying to give you a comparison.[/citation]

A very specific, and ultimately useless comparison.

 

[idisarmu]

[citation][nom]Jerther[/nom]Agreed... and I can't understand how charging batteries with a diesel engine would be more efficient than powering the darn car with the diesel engine itself... nonsens[/citation]

It is more efficient because this way, the engine can be run at a constant speed- which (unless GM is extremely stupid) will be the RPM at which the engine is most efficient.

Look at a dyno graph for an engine: http/diablosportpredatortuner.files.wordpress.com/2008/10/c6-z06-dyno-graph-diablosport-predator.jpg

Notice how the car's horsepower isn't a constant.When you are driving normally and not racing, the tachometer will read between 2000 and 3000 rpm even though most cars make the VAST MAJORITY of their power between 5000 and 6000 RPM. This means that if you have a 200 horsepower car, you will probably only be operating the engine at a speed at which is makes maybe 100-150 horsepower. In a hybrid, engineers can tune the car's engine to run at a constant speed at which is has the highest HP per (rate of fuel consumption). (for example: they can set the engine RPM to a level at which it makes 200HP while consuming 2 gallons/hour or 100hp while consuming 1.5 gallons/hour.)

 

[MrHorspwer]

It starts with 'tree huggers' in this case, early adopters. They cheapen it down for the rest of us. It is a 'proof of concept' and at least an attempt by a major auto company to try coping with the inevitable increase in energy costs over the next 25 years.

The most intelligent comment I've read in three pages.

Numbers and BS aside, GM took the bold step to develop something radically new and will be the first and only on the market. Since GM has garnered so much attention with the Volt, many automakers have stepped forward and said, "We're going to develop a plug-in too!" This was, of course, after we heard those same automakers say things like "immature battery technology" and "non-existant profit margins".

It often takes a single company and a single product to reshape an industy. 10 years ago, many auto execs were saying the exact same things about a Toyota product. A product who's first generation was so under-the-radar, most people can't identify it without looking at the badge. That was the Prius, which is now Toyota's golden egg and helps solidify it's favorable public preception as a "green" company that care about the environment, something GM could use right about now.

 

[blarneypete]

[citation][nom]ravenware[/nom]Gas fired? Thought they all used coal and nuclear. Anyway all fossil fueled power plants can be replaced. The gov will probably just tax us until it is out of style and never replace them.[/citation]
The power plant just down the road from my house runs on natural gas.

 

[matt87_50]

well then it doesn't go 230 miles per gallon then does it!

its like saying that the fastest cars in the world go 250 miles per hour. no they don't they'ed have to stop for fuel 4 times in an hour at that speed, so they wouldn't get 250 miles in an hour

 

[pakardbell486dx2]

guys there are 2 huge question we should be asking here. For how many recharge cycles will the battery last until till? How much will the damn thing cost when the time comes to replace the battery?