Failing Samsung HD in Dell laptop

[NualaC]

Unlike Jiannn I've not been all that happy with my Dell L501X and am now getting "HD about to fail" messages. The 580GB Samsung HM640JJ is only 10% full and I'm reluctant to replace it with another the same when it's failing with so much space still on it.

Will any SATA 2, 2.5" hard drive of similar capacity be OK or are there things to look out for? The Dell version specific to this machine is £94, which seems a lot when there seem to be similar ones priced around £60.

I don't know if you nominate particular brands on this site but I'd be most grateful for ideas about replacement. If somebody can suggest a specific one to go that would be great.

with thanks
Nuala

 

[Ubrales]

Welcome to Tom's Hardware Forums!

Stop using the laptop for regular use and take some precautionary measures right away!

1. Make a complete backup of all your files on to an external backup hard disk.

2. "Clone" the existing HDD that is failing on to a similar capacity or preferable larger HDD. This is a rather intensive and detailed task and please start a new thread on this. We will help you through this.

3. Any manufacturer's 2.5" (9.5mm thick is normal) HDD (laptop HDD) will fit your laptop. I prefer WD, Seagate, Toshiba, to name a few.

4. This might be a good opportunity for you to go with an SSD instead of the traditional HDD. SSDs are great, much faster, and more reliable as compared to HDDs.

5. I will post some links for reasonably priced SSDs and also for HDDs if you decide you want to stay with the older HDD technology.

 

[Ubrales]

SSDs in general are much faster, more reliable, newer technology, and higher priced than HDDs.

SSDs.
Intel 180 GB - http/www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820167172
Intel 180 GB - http/www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820167151 (reseller packaging)
Corsair 180 GB - http/www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233311
Corsair 240 GB - http/www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233312

HDDs.
WD 320 GB 7200 RPM - http/www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822236563
WD 320 GB 5400 RPM - http/www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA2W00ZC7762
Seagate 320 GB 5400 RPM - http/www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822148532

From the above list, my pick is the Corsair 240 GB SSD.

If cost is a factor, then go with any of the three HDDs listed above. The 7200 RPM HDD will be slightly faster than the 5400 RPM HDD, but no where close to the speed or performance of any SSD.

 

[NualaC]

Ubrales
Thank you very much for your two useful and very full replies and for the welcome to the forum. I hope I'm replying in the correct bit. I seem to have lost sight of where I can select your answer as the best but hope to come upon it again and duly commend your post.

I have an external Seagate drive and have already copied files on to it but was daunted by the instructions on cloning so haven't attempted it. Help with the process would be more than welcome, thank you. I'll start a new thread on that.

I'll look at the SSDs and HDDs you list and the prices - many many thanks too for sifting out a manageable few from the dozens and dozens available.

Nuala


Welcome to Tom's Hardware Forums!

Stop using the laptop for regular use and take some precautionary measures right away!

1. Make a complete backup of all your files on to an external backup hard disk.

2. "Clone" the existing HDD that is failing on to a similar capacity or preferable larger HDD. This is a rather intensive and detailed task and please start a new thread on this. We will help you through this.

3. Any manufacturer's 2.5" (9.5mm thick is normal) HDD (laptop HDD) will fit your laptop. I prefer WD, Seagate, Toshiba, to name a few.

4. This might be a good opportunity for you to go with an SSD instead of the traditional HDD. SSDs are great, much faster, and more reliable as compared to HDDs.

5. I will post some links for reasonably priced SSDs and also for HDDs if you decide you want to stay with the older HDD technology.[/quotemsg]

 

[Ubrales]

Ubrales
Thank you very much for your two useful and very full replies and for the welcome to the forum. I hope I'm replying in the correct bit. I seem to have lost sight of where I can select your answer as the best but hope to come upon it again and duly commend your post.

I have an external Seagate drive and have already copied files on to it but was daunted by the instructions on cloning so haven't attempted it. Help with the process would be more than welcome, thank you. I'll start a new thread on that.

I'll look at the SSDs and HDDs you list and the prices - many many thanks too for sifting out a manageable few from the dozens and dozens available.

Nuala
.

Thank you!

Either solution (SSD or HDD) will work well for you. I will help you with details on the cloning task. It is not as intimidating as the task sounds.

http/www.apricorn.com/products/software/ezgig.html

You will need this: http/www.apricorn.com/products/desktop-ssd-hdd-upgrade-kits/drivewire-ide-pata-sata-to-usb-hdd-adapter.html (costs about $35 at computer stores).

 

[Ubrales]

Drivewire:

http/www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812161002
http/www.microcenter.com/product/259920/DriveWire_Universal_Hard_Drive_Adapter
http/www.bestbuy.com/site/apricorn-drivewire-universal-hard-drive-adapter-metallic-red/1004959.p?id=1218207307519&skuId=1004959

 

[NualaC]

Ubrales, hello again and thank you for this further suggestion about PC Cleaner Plus, which I've downloaded, and for the advice on cloning equipment. I've ordered a WD 320GB HDD from your earlier list of drives.

Btw I cannot back up the existing drive properly (it reports errors). That was why I just copied the things I specially wanted to keep on to the external drive. Now I am wondering if the same thing wld happen with the cloning procedure?

 

[Ubrales]

Cloning as the name implies will create an EXACT copy of the original disk; errors and all!

The first thing to do is to backup your data files on to an external disk, and you stated that you have done that. Good!

Then do the cloning anyway. This way you will have two identical HDDs and you can keep one safely while you trouble-shoot the other . If nothing (trouble shooting) works you have not lost anything. You are still where you started and you can proceed with plan B.

Plan B is more intensive but not complicated; just takes longer. Plan B is to replace the HDD with the new HDD, format it NTFS, and then re-install everything. I must caution you on one aspect and that is the Operating System (OS). The OS cannot be re-installed on a new HDD using the CD provided by the laptop manufacturer. They usually provide a "re-installation" CD to re-install the OS from another partition on the hard disk. But if the hard disk has failed completely this partition is of no use. This means buying a new OS. There are some options but we can discuss these later after knowing the present state of affairs.

Next, turn the laptop over and look for the HDD area. Looking at my Dells now, I see one has three screws, and the other laptop has four screws that retain the HDD.

Using a precision Phillips screwdriver (jewelers type) that fits the Phillips socket snugly, carefully remove the screws. Instead of me re-inventing the wheel, here is a great video which explains the procedure well: http/www.youtube.com/watch?v=-OHkVv9RFik

Based on your findings we can proceed.

 

[NualaC]

Cloning as the name implies will create an EXACT copy of the original disk; errors and all!

The first thing to do is to backup your data files on to an external disk, and you stated that you have done that. Good!

Then do the cloning anyway. This way you will have two identical HDDs and you can keep one safely while you trouble-shoot the other . If nothing (trouble shooting) works you have not lost anything. You are still where you started and you can proceed with plan B.

Plan B is more intensive but not complicated; just takes longer. Plan B is to replace the HDD with the new HDD, format it NTFS, and then re-install everything. I must caution you on one aspect and that is the Operating System (OS). The OS cannot be re-installed on a new HDD using the CD provided by the laptop manufacturer. They usually provide a "re-installation" CD to re-install the OS from another partition on the hard disk. But if the hard disk has failed completely this partition is of no use. This means buying a new OS. There are some options but we can discuss these later after knowing the present state of affairs.

Next, turn the laptop over and look for the HDD area. Looking at my Dells now, I see one has three screws, and the other laptop has four screws that retain the HDD.

Using a precision Phillips screwdriver (jewelers type) that fits the Phillips socket snugly, carefully remove the screws. Instead of me re-inventing the wheel, here is a great video which explains the procedure well: http/www.youtube.com/watch?v=-OHkVv9RFik

Based on your findings we can proceed.

 

[Ubrales]

Any response?

 

[NualaC]

Ubrales, my brother thinks he may have cloning equipment so am holding off on that for the moment.

So I wonder how useful is cloning likely to be? I've tried several of the "cleanup" and registry-sorting-out apps that are available and although all busily delete redundant stuff like anything, the machine still ends up giving me these plaintive HD failure messages. (Even when the app I've just tried has pronounced it to be in the best of health). Earlier I tried getting back to C:\ to run CHKDSK but it appears Microsoft won't let you any more; it interposes a > sign after the \ and a snotty message appears saying you are not sufficiently privileged (on my own computer??) and would have to be operating "in elevated mode". I guess MS is up there permanently gazing down on the small world of humans below.

I have followed Plan B with a previous computer (I don't remember exactly what I did but it took me some time and some guidance would certainly be very welcome indeed if that turns out to be the way to go). The same brother says he has an installable copy of Windows 7 so no worries there. I have a System Restore set of files on a memory stick, made when I got this machine, and also the Dell disk with Drivers and Utilities though it must be pretty out of date now (dated Sept 2010). I printed off a demo of how to change the HDD itself (mine has three screws). So Im already part way to being able to do that I think. A lot of the stuff on the machine isn't worth cloning frankly. But I guess I will lose any preinstalled software like MSOffice2010 Starter which I find useful, and probably other things I've not thought of. As you point out, I'm not losing anything by cloning, even if it doesn't advance matters.

The above is thinking aloud - what wld you do? Clone or go straight for the replacement when the new HD arrives and re-install as far as poss? What sort of thing is likely to be wrong with the HDD? Is it likely to be relevant that I've been continuously running the CPDN climate experiment since I got the machine, i.e. number crunching 24/7? Have I just made it old and tired before its time, with arthritic knees, as it were, that can't be sorted?

 

[Ubrales]

Well, the 'elevated rights' mean that only a user with 'Admin' rights can make changes. This is good and that's the way it should be.

Always use your computer with 'Standard' or limited rights as this is safer in preventing malware attacks. A 'Standard' user cannot install software or execute "exe" files which may contain malware. That's the advantage. "Spybot S & D" needs Admin rights in order to run. Similar with "SPECCY".

When you want to install new software (programs) or do certain tasks just log in as the Admin and now you have elevated rights just to tide you through the tasks you are trying to do.

In order to check the HDD you can download and run "HDTune" or "CrystalDiskInfo" or both. These programs will check for disk errors. On my HDDs I look particularly for "re-allocated sectors count" - I want to see zero in the raw values.

24/7 number crunching should not be a problem at all. All processing, even MS Word (word processing) is in fact number crunching to the computer. Everything is converted to binary (zeros and ones) and then processed in the computer. Even photos are stored in binary inside the computer and on external disks.

As far as HDDs are concerned, they are high precision electro-mechanical devices and that is subject to normal wear and tear, and sometimes premature failures. On automated production lines at all factories a certain amount of near-defects do slip through the final inspection and testing. The cost of perfect products is infinite!

We can still try the cloning approach since you have access to the hardware. The cloning software 'EZ Gig' is a free download from Apricorn. And if the HDD trouble-shooting works then you have salvaged Office 2010.

If doing these things don't hit paydirt, and since you have the new HDD and an installable version of Windows,we can go with a new OS install. You will need a new version of MS Office. The Home & Student version of MS Office 2010 is around $120 for three computers.

 

[NualaC]

Ubrales,
If James (brother) can't find the cloning device I will go for the Drivewire universal one that you mention, thank you. May I then please get back in touch if I run into problems with the process?

This exchange has been most illuminating - thank you again for your helpful and patient responses. Since nobody but me uses this machine I had naively assumed that I was the admin person, but then I didn't originally set it up, did I. It is really the peremptory and apparently uppity tone of the messages that is annoying. If they explained what was going on in terms similar to those you have just deployed it would be less likely to produce the raised hackles reaction. Why not just say "Please log in as Admin if you want to do x?"

 

[Ubrales]

Ubrales,
If James (brother) can't find the cloning device I will go for the Drivewire universal one that you mention, thank you. May I then please get back in touch if I run into problems with the process?

This exchange has been most illuminating - thank you again for your helpful and patient responses. Since nobody but me uses this machine I had naively assumed that I was the admin person, but then I didn't originally set it up, did I. It is really the peremptory and apparently uppity tone of the messages that is annoying. If they explained what was going on in terms similar to those you have just deployed it would be less likely to produce the raised hackles reaction. Why not just say "Please log in as Admin if you want to do x?"

Yes I completely agree with you! In fact, whenever I get the opportunity I send feedback to Microsoft and my primary message is that their software people (mostly from India) do NOT know English very well; they THINK they do and that can be a huge problem sometimes. One Example: When I first tried to do some backup the prompt was "See the Backup & Restore Control Panel" - So I thought that there was a separate Control Panel for Backup & Restore. That is not the case. What the guy (or gal) intended to convey was "See Control Panel, Backup & Restore". What happened was that they just translated it verbatim from some Indian language (grammatically correct) and expected it to be grammatically correct in English. Unfortunately, my comments and suggestions would be read by the same people (MS Indians)who do not have a good grasp of English. Guides and tutorials should be left in the hands of people whose first language is English.

Now back to the HDD. Dell does not make HDDs. They buy WD, Seagate, or some other brand and sometimes private label it and sell it with a markup which is normal business practice.

And 2.5" HDD will work in laptops. However there is a caveat! Some laptop HDDs are 9.5mm thick and some 9.0mm thick. I have two that I pulled out from my Dell laptops sitting on my desk. The Seagate measures 9.5mm and the Fujitsu measures 9.0mm..

When you pull out the HDD from your laptop measure it.

And yes, you may send me a PM anytime on these computer issues. If I don't have the answer I shall try and get it for you.

 

[Ubrales]

I sent you a PM.

 

[Ubrales]

In support of your observation, here are some interesting reasons why English is not as easy as some think it is:

Reasons why the English language is so hard to learn:

1. The bandage was wound around the wound.

2. The farm was used to produce produce.

3. The dump was so full that it had to refuse more refuse.

4. We must polish the Polish furniture.

5. He could lead if he would get the lead out.

6. The soldier decided to desert his dessert in the desert.

7. Since there is no time like the present, he thought it was time to present the present.

8. A bass was painted on the head of the bass drum.

9. When shot at, the dove dove into the bushes.

10. I did not object to the object.

11. The insurance was invalid for the invalid.

12. There was a row among the oarsmen about how to row.

13. They were too close to the door to close it.

14. The buck does funny things when the does are present.

15. A seamstress and a sewer fell down into a sewer line.

16. To help with planting, the farmer taught his sow to sow.

17. The wind was too strong to wind the sail.

18. After a number of injections my jaw got number.

19. Upon seeing the tear in the painting I shed a tear.

20. I had to subject the subject to a series of tests.

21. How can I intimate this to my most intimate friend?

There is no egg in eggplant, nor ham in hamburger; neither apple nor pine in pineapple. English muffins weren't invented in England or French fries in France (surprise!).
Sweetmeats are candies while sweetbreads, which aren't sweet, are meat. Quicksand works slowly, boxing rings are square, and a guinea pig is neither from Guinea nor is it a pig.
And why is it that writers write, but fingers don't fing, grocers don't groce and hammers don't ham?
If the plural of tooth is teeth, why isn't the plural of booth beeth? One goose two geese, so one moose, two meese? Doesn't it seem crazy, that you can make amends but not one amend. If you have a bunch of odds and ends and get rid of all but one of them, what do you call it? Is it an odd, or an end?
If teachers taught, why didn't preachers praught? If a vegetarian eats vegetables, what does a humanitarian eat? In what language do people recite at a play and play at a recital? Ship by truck and send cargo by ship?
Have noses that run and feet that smell? How can a slim chance and a fat chance be the same, while a wise man and a wise guy are opposites? You have to marvel at the unique lunacy of a language in which your house can burn up as it burns down, in which you fill in a form by filling it out, and in which, an alarm goes off by going on.
English was invented by people, not computers, and it reflects the creativity of the human race, which, of course, is not a race at all. That is why, when the stars are out, they are visible, but when the lights are out, they are invisible.

Have fun!

 

[NualaC]

Well, enjoyed your list for a good laugh, Ubrales .... thanks be I'm a native speaker, and I take my hat off to those who aren't,but still manage to make any kind of sense. Including those clever MS Indians even when they hijack words for concepts in computerspeak. And hail too to our one year old brains that somehow get to grips with the language in the first place.

Here's a different linguistic oddity - the Gaelic for "put on" as in "put on your coat" is also used for "put on the light", clearly an entirely different operation. Only someone bilingual in Gaelic and English could come up with that. It makes you wonder how a bilingual brain works.

However, this is nothing to do with computers so I won't take up more space. Will let you know how the HD operation goes (or not) if I may, and any progress on the cloning operation. Thanks for the tip about measurement.
Nuala