Hmmm didn't I predict this over a year ago

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

MegaZone wrote:
> Tony D <nospam@nospam.com> shaped the electrons to say:
>
>>Let's see:
>
>
> Yeah, a post full of FUD. No better than the 'RTV is going out of
> business' posts you hate.
>

Why a Tivo cheerleader would post to a Replay forum is beyond me. But be
that as it may, I'll ask you to also keep an eye on this and let us know
when it happens.

And your assessment of Tivo's finances vs DNNA is hilarious. Like I also
said, don't list your theories, call a broker.

 

[Guest]

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"Elmo P. Shagnasty" <elmop@nastydesigns.com> shaped the electrons to say:
>> Even with your low-end 600Kbps download speed it is 33 hours for
>> 8.5GB, and the video from a DVD is never even clost to that.
>A friend of mine gets his stuff the next day from Netflix. He's near a
>distribution center or something.

And he has to return the DVDs too. Sure, it won't be for everyone,
but that's 33 hours for 8.5GB over a link that, by today's standards,
is slow. I could get 6Mbps DSL or 3Mbps cable modem service here,
most broadband users have services of at least 1.5Mbps available.

Even TiVo and Netflix have said they don't expect any significant
revenue for broadband rentals for several years. Netflix said
something like 1 in 1000 customers may use it in the early days. This
isn't going to pump up their bottom lines any time soon, so it isn't
about making money in the short term - it is a long term investment.

>My guess is that if you're out in the boonies, where broadband doesn't
>exist or is iffy, the postal service is your best bet.

I live in a major city (Worcester used to be second only to Boston in
New England, but I think it dropped a couple of places) and I could
probably download a full DVD over my DSL faster than the post would
get it to me. And I don't have to bother returning anything.

Both ReplayTV and TiVo thought this was a good idea a few years ago,
but investments dried up. And they were probably both too early since
broadband was just spreading. But today there are many more people
with broadband, and the average connection speed is higher - and
steadily increasing.

-MZ, RHCE #806199299900541, ex-CISSP #3762
--
<URL:mailto:megazoneatmegazone.org> Gweep, Discordian, Author, Engineer, me.
"A little nonsense now and then, is relished by the wisest men" 508-755-4098
<URL:http/www.megazone.org/> <URL:http/www.eyrie-productions.com/> Eris

 

[Guest]

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Tony D wrote:


> BS. Streaming of this sort is impossible. I can get 600k downloads via
> cable, but have yet to find a site that streams crummy 3" media player
> screens reliably. And most people don't have my d/l speed.

I'll second what someone said about 600K Download speeds via cable, I
get 970 to 1,000K on DSL (1meg or 1,000K is T-1 speed)

Cable (at my daughters) 2-3 times that.

I find that ABC-News (Note, I get it free, you don't) 300K streams are
very high quality... Often better than Replay STANDARD (at least on this
monitor) I've viewed both in full screen mode and liked it.

Of course.... What you have "Under the hood" makes a difference too

IE: this laptop is a 333 MHz I'd not wish to use anything much slower
to watch video... Main is 1.8 GHz and the "new" computer I just picked
up at the bargain auction ($3.00, yes $3.00) is a 1GHz AMD with a
kick-screen video card and what looks like a top end Sound blaster

What it does not have is an OS

But I was able to get in and poke around a bit with tools I have on my
laptop

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

>
> I'll second what someone said about 600K Download speeds via cable, I
> get 970 to 1,000K on DSL (1meg or 1,000K is T-1 speed)
>
> Cable (at my daughters) 2-3 times that.
>
> I find that ABC-News (Note, I get it free, you don't) 300K streams are
> very high quality... Often better than Replay STANDARD (at least on this
> monitor) I've viewed both in full screen mode and liked it.
>
> Of course.... What you have "Under the hood" makes a difference too

I was not referring to "rated speed". Comcast recently doubled our speed
(yeah, right). What that basicaly means is if you d/l from the next
guy on the leg you get great speed. Across the internet, with huge files
and half the stops along the way throttling your connection 600k is
pretty good. Megazone refers to 3m dsl, which is laughable also because
Ma & Pa Kettle who own most Tivos aren't going for it, even if it was
available.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

Tony D wrote:

>
>>
>> Tell me more about the NEtflix deal
>>
>> I currently get my NETFLIX, Play them into the RePlay, send them back
>> and then make a decision on what to do with the MPEG (Burn to DVD,
>> burn to Transfer DVD (first is burn as dvd, the second is burn as mpeg
>> for viewing on computers only) or save to HD for viewing and discard
>> (Default action)
>>
>> But if there is a better deal..... I'm interested
>
>
> Seems like a tedious process. My friend simply copies every dvd he gets
> and puts the original back in the mail the same day. They are very fast
> so it costs like a $1 each.
>
> Under the Tivo deal, you won't be able to make a copy and the unit will
> automatically delete it after 1 or 2 showings or after X days even
> unwatched. Because of the file sizes involved, it will either take
> forever to d/l or they will send a bastardized version (ie: vcd
> quality). Ready to sign up? Like I said, a publicity stunt.

Oh, it's a TIVO deal... I already kind of posted my feelings on TIVO
(I looked at them only long enough to hear about the RePlay and then any
thought of buying a TIVO died a quick death)

As for the tedious process.... I keep telling people that there is a way
to do "Real Time Recording" without having to sit there for an hour or
two while a movie copies to the Replay

1: Set up DVD to play but do not push the play button just yet

2: Set up replay to do a timed manual record starting in say, 2 minutes

3: Sit there for two minutes... The replay will do the
10-9-8-7-6-5-4-3-2-1-RECORDING (now you press play on the DVD player)

Go to __________________ (lunch, dinner, breakfast, church, shopping,
bed, date with your dateable person, whatever) come back in 1,2,3,6,8,
10 (more) hours (whenever you get back to it)

Re-name the show on the recorder, remove DVD from player and ship back
to NETFLIX

Your total time, under five minutes

Of course some DVDs (Mostly TV shows) you have to record Each episode
(chapter analog) but most movies play straight through.

Three examples of TV show DVDs

RED DWARF (British Science Fiction Comedy) One push, chop later if you
like or run as one

X-Files Each episode

Avengers (British "Spy" type show) Each Episode

There was one other TV show... I can't remember it's name but it played
through (Plot is a bunch of renegade spacers, I'm a science fiction fan)

(Watched it b-4 I got the replay, show not that good)

So no matter how much work it is... It's only a few minutes for me, and
then it's lights out or go out and let the box do it's thing in peace.

Oh yes.... Works the other way too... Wife could not understand the
replay to save her self... But she does VHS just fine

So... Today, while doing other things... I taped a show we both watch
off the replay.. Replay, of course, done the capture

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote:

> In article <sw%0d.1131$Qv5.458@newssvr33.news.prodigy.com>,
> John in Detroit <Blanked@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
>
>>I currently get my NETFLIX, Play them into the RePlay, send them back
>>and then make a decision on what to do with the MPEG
>
>
> Why not just dupe it to a read/write DVD of some flavor, then decide
> what to do with it? If you don't like it, just rewrite the DVD.
>
> It's faster than playing it real-time into the RTV, and much more
> accurate to boot.
>
> And, best of all, it's free to do once you have a Wintel box with a DVD
> writer.
>

Though I do indeed have a WIN box with a DVD burner (External Backpack
drive) the problem is the laptop I normally watch on is not quite up to
DVD, at least not DVD via USB (it is supposed to be able to play DVD
direct if I get a drive for it)

Replay plays fine.. Same program in fact (Power DVD) to play it

I only have occassional issues doing a Replay file.. .Usually those are
when I try to multitask the computer.

So... It's easier this way

Also... I'm not yet up to the rip&burn stage with DVD's. And so far all
I've seen is "Can Not Copy" Since RePlay and the computer do most of
the work automatically, w/o any help from me beyond the setup, which I'
d have to do if I did a stragit disk copy Not much point in burning
media when I can burn hard drive

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

> Though I do indeed have a WIN box with a DVD burner (External Backpack
> drive) the problem is the laptop I normally watch on is not quite up to
> DVD, at least not DVD via USB (it is supposed to be able to play DVD
> direct if I get a drive for it)
>
> Replay plays fine.. Same program in fact (Power DVD) to play it
>
> I only have occassional issues doing a Replay file.. .Usually those are
> when I try to multitask the computer.
>
> So... It's easier this way
>
> Also... I'm not yet up to the rip&burn stage with DVD's. And so far all
> I've seen is "Can Not Copy"

Get DVDShrink (free), it will remove encryption, reencode to fit a DVD-9
to DVD-5 and even burn the result if you have 2 drives. Auto mode is a
simple click and do it all.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 11:22:10 -0400, Tony D <nospam@nospam.com> wrote:

>
>> Though I do indeed have a WIN box with a DVD burner (External Backpack
>> drive) the problem is the laptop I normally watch on is not quite up to
>> DVD, at least not DVD via USB (it is supposed to be able to play DVD
>> direct if I get a drive for it)
>>
>> Replay plays fine.. Same program in fact (Power DVD) to play it
>>
>> I only have occassional issues doing a Replay file.. .Usually those are
>> when I try to multitask the computer.
>>
>> So... It's easier this way
>>
>> Also... I'm not yet up to the rip&burn stage with DVD's. And so far all
>> I've seen is "Can Not Copy"
>
>Get DVDShrink (free), it will remove encryption, reencode to fit a DVD-9
>to DVD-5 and even burn the result if you have 2 drives. Auto mode is a
>simple click and do it all.

I've used that and it works. I wonder it it's compatibe with the new
DVD+R DL drives (the media won't always be so expensive).

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

I think the biggest problem with the overall Replay situation is they seem
to be doing nothing but selling off old units, nothing more. What else have
they done??
No update to web programming? No media push...nothing!

I was thinking of buying a third unit, but I'm honestly wondering if I
should.
I don't even see the units in Best Buy or Circuit City anymore.

"Greg" <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20040911130700.01302.00000469@mb-m04.aol.com...
> And RTV missed the boat ... again
>
> http/www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5915470/site/newsweek/

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

>
>>Get DVDShrink (free), it will remove encryption, reencode to fit a DVD-9
>>to DVD-5 and even burn the result if you have 2 drives. Auto mode is a
>>simple click and do it all.
>
>
> I've used that and it works. I wonder it it's compatibe with the new
> DVD+R DL drives (the media won't always be so expensive).
>

I'm sure the author will update it. He supplies the "guts" to the same
program within Nero (without decryption though!). The media is hideously
expensive. It will be some time before it is cheap. It will be rare to
find a movie that needs it. After removing various languages, etc, you
can't even see artifacts on the finished project. The new version has an
even more extensive system for adaptive compression and a sharpening
filter that may take a lot longer but provides fabulous results.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

Tony D <Tony_D@nospam.com> wrote:
>The media is hideously expensive.

50 cents (17 cents for generic) a disc isn't CD-R cheap, but it's not really
all that expensive anymore.

--
<script language="JavaScript">// Scott Seligman
for(var i=0;i<73;i++)document.write(String.fromCharCode(("lsYrsiwb7pir~~|=~fr"+
"~}Rvvrxv~Q}gx~}lz~wmwiqz|sq~tuBpNpzyvp@Lu[").charCodeAt(i)-("P2Y*!$1E5#()2*-"+
"#+##*)E!#-*1*1*$)*)+,:*$4!,.0.c0/!@R)cM8-$$=4=").charCodeAt(i)+32));</script>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

Scott Seligman wrote:

> Tony D <Tony_D@nospam.com> wrote:
>
>>The media is hideously expensive.
>
>
> 50 cents (17 cents for generic) a disc isn't CD-R cheap, but it's not really
> all that expensive anymore.
>
What are you talking about. Dual Layer disks are $12.50 each.

 

[Guest]

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Tony D <Tony_D@nospam.com> wrote:
>Scott Seligman wrote:
>
>> Tony D <Tony_D@nospam.com> wrote:
>>
>>>The media is hideously expensive.
>>
>>
>> 50 cents (17 cents for generic) a disc isn't CD-R cheap, but it's not really
>> all that expensive anymore.
>>
>What are you talking about. Dual Layer disks are $12.50 each.

Sorry, got my formats confused.

--
<script language="JavaScript">// Scott Seligman
for(var i=0;i<73;i++)document.write(String.fromCharCode(("lsYrsiwb7pir~~|=~fr"+
"~}Rvvrxv~Q}gx~}lz~wmwiqz|sq~tuBpNpzyvp@Lu[").charCodeAt(i)-("P2Y*!$1E5#()2*-"+
"#+##*)E!#-*1*1*$)*)+,:*$4!,.0.c0/!@R)cM8-$$=4=").charCodeAt(i)+32));</script>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

Tony D <nospam@nospam.com> shaped the electrons to say:
>Why a Tivo cheerleader would post to a Replay forum is beyond me. But be

Anyone who doesn't spout the party line is a TiVo cheerleader to you,
I've been watching you for a while. So easy to dismiss any arguments
you don't like that way, isn't it?

I read a LOT of DVR related groups, mailing lists, etc. I'm
interested in the market overall. And I even answer questions for
users since I know a fair bit about a number of different products,
TiVo or not. I'm not so small minded that I only want to read about
products I use.

>And your assessment of Tivo's finances vs DNNA is hilarious. Like I also
>said, don't list your theories, call a broker.

My assessment? I see you also lack any reading comprehension. Did
you notice how I said your post was full of FUD (you know what that
is, right? Fear, Uncertainty, and Doubt - a common scare tactic used
by those with no real arguments) and 'no better than' the posts about
RTV going out of business?

Anyone would reading comprehension would understand that I think
*both* posts are FUD.

Let me spell it out to you so you understand.

I think your posts about the potential Tivo/Netflex deal (which is
just an industry rumor, I'd note) are pure FUD. Complete bullshit
without any supporting facts. How can there be supporting facts when
*neither* Netflix nor TiVo have made any announcements and the
comments amount to 'no comment'. Everything at this point is
spectulation by industry reporters with 'inside sources'. So when you
post about exhorbinant prices, etc, you're pulling it out of your ass.

In the same vein posts about how RTV is going to go out of business
are silly too. I do believe that DNNA is pulling out of the
standalone DVR business. That market is getting crowded and, frankly,
RTV lost the war for that market years ago. The margins are being
squeezed hard and even TiVo is moving to branch out of the pure DVR
market with integrated devices like DVD recorders, which analysts
agree are the next big growth market. Many years ago SonicBlue
announced their intention to product an RTV/DVD-RW box - but that
never came to be.

DNNA appears to have decided to abandon the standalone market to
pursue integrated media servers with DVR features. Not an
unreasonable move, the margins in that market are MUCH higher and it
is a new area without a lot of competition. I was at CES2004 and I
saw their product, it looked interesting - if a bit pricey. It hasn't
shipped yet, but I'm sure it will.

I doubt DNNA is going to fold up, as some have tried to indicate. I
do think that 'ReplayTV' as a standalong DVR is probably on its last
legs. After the buyout DNNA dropped features then in development,
like MP3 support and USB WiFi support, and they haven't updated the HW
at all. Apparently not even a manufacturing respin to use newer
components and reduce costs. There was one major SW bump for the 5500
release which dropped Send Show and Commercial Advance and added
Show|Nav.

You like to spread FUD about TiVo and call people 'TiVo cheerleaders',
I like to actually intelligently discuss facts.

What you're doing is the same thing as the people who FUD about RTV
that you like to slam. Maybe you should look in the mirror.

-MZ, RHCE #806199299900541, ex-CISSP #3762
--
<URL:mailto:megazoneatmegazone.org> Gweep, Discordian, Author, Engineer, me.
"A little nonsense now and then, is relished by the wisest men" 508-755-4098
<URL:http/www.megazone.org/> <URL:http/www.eyrie-productions.com/> Eris

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

Tony D wrote:

>
>>
>> I'll second what someone said about 600K Download speeds via cable, I
>> get 970 to 1,000K on DSL (1meg or 1,000K is T-1 speed)
>>
>> Cable (at my daughters) 2-3 times that.
>>
>> I find that ABC-News (Note, I get it free, you don't) 300K streams are
>> very high quality... Often better than Replay STANDARD (at least on
>> this monitor) I've viewed both in full screen mode and liked it.
>>
>> Of course.... What you have "Under the hood" makes a difference too
>
>
> I was not referring to "rated speed". Comcast recently doubled our speed
> (yeah, right). What that basicaly means is if you d/l from the next guy
> on the leg you get great speed. Across the internet, with huge files and
> half the stops along the way throttling your connection 600k is pretty
> good. Megazone refers to 3m dsl, which is laughable also because Ma & Pa
> Kettle who own most Tivos aren't going for it, even if it was available.

When I say I geet 1 Meg per second... I'm talking about visiting
www.wugnet.com and using their speed tester. Or Mcaffee's so it's
actuall, Internet, download speed.
'
When I speak of 300K. That is the reported speed of a very high quality
video streem I often watch. These are actuall tested and/or reported
speeds provided by my computer. Not advertisments but test results

www.broadband.com has a speed tester or three and collects speed reportsb

 

[john]

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 19:42:07 GMT, John in Detroit
<Blanked@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

>Tony D wrote:
>
>>
>>>
>>> I'll second what someone said about 600K Download speeds via cable, I
>>> get 970 to 1,000K on DSL (1meg or 1,000K is T-1 speed)
>>>
>>> Cable (at my daughters) 2-3 times that.
>>>
>>> I find that ABC-News (Note, I get it free, you don't) 300K streams are
>>> very high quality... Often better than Replay STANDARD (at least on
>>> this monitor) I've viewed both in full screen mode and liked it.
>>>
>>> Of course.... What you have "Under the hood" makes a difference too
>>
>>
>> I was not referring to "rated speed". Comcast recently doubled our speed
>> (yeah, right). What that basicaly means is if you d/l from the next guy
>> on the leg you get great speed. Across the internet, with huge files and
>> half the stops along the way throttling your connection 600k is pretty
>> good. Megazone refers to 3m dsl, which is laughable also because Ma & Pa
>> Kettle who own most Tivos aren't going for it, even if it was available.
>
>When I say I geet 1 Meg per second... I'm talking about visiting
>www.wugnet.com and using their speed tester. Or Mcaffee's so it's
>actuall, Internet, download speed.
>'
>When I speak of 300K. That is the reported speed of a very high quality
>video streem I often watch. These are actuall tested and/or reported
>speeds provided by my computer. Not advertisments but test results
>
>www.broadband.com has a speed tester or three and collects speed reportsb

Have you considered providing actual links for these things? Both
refer to pages with no indication of speed tests.

Here's one that actually works: http/www.dslreports.com/stest

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

Tony D wrote:

>
>> Though I do indeed have a WIN box with a DVD burner (External Backpack
>> drive) the problem is the laptop I normally watch on is not quite up
>> to DVD, at least not DVD via USB (it is supposed to be able to play
>> DVD direct if I get a drive for it)
>>
>> Replay plays fine.. Same program in fact (Power DVD) to play it
>>
>> I only have occassional issues doing a Replay file.. .Usually those
>> are when I try to multitask the computer.
>>
>> So... It's easier this way
>>
>> Also... I'm not yet up to the rip&burn stage with DVD's. And so far
>> all I've seen is "Can Not Copy"
>
>
> Get DVDShrink (free), it will remove encryption, reencode to fit a DVD-9
> to DVD-5 and even burn the result if you have 2 drives. Auto mode is a
> simple click and do it all.

Already have it Have never used it however.

But I'd say from looking at the directions it's no easier than what I do now

Of course the job this week is setting up a new computer

It's a 1.0 GHz AMD with a bunch of ram and 60 Gigs of HD. High end
graphics and sound. No modem (at the moment, I may fix that.... Or not)
and no operating system... But it does work. Seems some drug dealer
decided he did not need his computer any more... I got it (properly
cleaned) at police auction for $3.00b

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

Tony D wrote:

> Scott Seligman wrote:
>
>> Tony D <Tony_D@nospam.com> wrote:
>>
>>> The media is hideously expensive.
>>
>>
>>
>> 50 cents (17 cents for generic) a disc isn't CD-R cheap, but it's not
>> really
>> all that expensive anymore.
>>
> What are you talking about. Dual Layer disks are $12.50 each.

He said what he is talking about CD, not DVD

And he's paying way too much for CD's. I've gotten brand name (SONY)
CD-R for as low as EIGHT cents per disk

 

[Guest]

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Tony D <nospam@nospam.com> shaped the electrons to say:
> (yeah, right). What that basicaly means is if you d/l from the next
>guy on the leg you get great speed. Across the internet, with huge files
>and half the stops along the way throttling your connection 600k is

Still sounds weak, I can get over 1Mbps downloading from most major
servers. Some servers throttle their connections to control hogs, but
that's the server - obviously you wouldn't want to do that with a
movie server if you can avoid it.

I know all about head-end congestion. I used to work for GTEI, and we
provided the head-end backhaul for several cable modem and DSL
plants. They tend to go through boom/bust cycles. When first
installed the first users get plenty of bandwidth, then they sell
services until they've massively over-subscribed the head-end. Then
they upgrade the head-end and everyone has more then they need - until
they over-subscribe again. Lather, rinse, repeat.

Generally though, it is only a few hours of the day that things really
get tight - overnight the bandwidth usage plummets and downloads are
fast. One of the benefits to being a night owl, I never had to deal
with using my line during peak hours.

>pretty good. Megazone refers to 3m dsl, which is laughable also because
>Ma & Pa Kettle who own most Tivos aren't going for it, even if it was

Verizon is bumping their minimum ADSL download speed to 3Mbps, area by
area. Which means if you get their *minimum* DSL, you get 3Mbps.
Charter is doing the same with their cable modems. Faster speeds are
available in some areas. Speakeasy offers a 6Mbps service, but it
costs more than most people are probably willing to spend. And there
really isn't much need for that much speed now anyway.

Chicken and egg - if movie services become popular that'd drive the
desire for fatter pipes. That's how it always is.

2400bps is fast enough for *text*. If all you were doing was running
shell and looking at text, that's all you need. 9600bps is plenty
faster for updating text then any human can read.

The desires for faster speeds were driven by the desire for graphics,
then animations, then video, music, etc. At each stage there is
always a period when technology gets ahead of the pipes, and things
are too slow, until enough people want the new shiny thing and it
drives the market to produce fatter pipes - and/or better compression.

V.42/V/42bis were the standard for a LONG time, until V.44 was
produced to wring the last drop out of dial up. After the bump from
V.34 to V.90/V.92 maxed out the pipe. Analog modems will never get
faster than V.92, it is a limitation of the infrastructure.


I'd love to see what the people poo-poo'ing this idea would say if
DNNA turns around and says they're looking into it again too. I bet
suddenly it wouldn't seem like such a dumb idea then, for some
reason...

-MZ, RHCE #806199299900541, ex-CISSP #3762
--
<URL:mailto:megazoneatmegazone.org> Gweep, Discordian, Author, Engineer, me.
"A little nonsense now and then, is relished by the wisest men" 508-755-4098
<URL:http/www.megazone.org/> <URL:http/www.eyrie-productions.com/> Eris

 

[Guest]

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wa8yxm@do.not.spam.arrl.net shaped the electrons to say:
>I'll second what someone said about 600K Download speeds via cable, I
>get 970 to 1,000K on DSL (1meg or 1,000K is T-1 speed)

Actually a T1 is 1.536Mbps (1.544Mbps including overhead).

24 64Kbps channels.

-MZ, RHCE #806199299900541, ex-CISSP #3762
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<URL:mailto:megazoneatmegazone.org> Gweep, Discordian, Author, Engineer, me.
"A little nonsense now and then, is relished by the wisest men" 508-755-4098
<URL:http/www.megazone.org/> <URL:http/www.eyrie-productions.com/> Eris