But it's not slander, and slander doesn't land you in jail in America. Libel, which is *factually inaccurate* slander might land you a lawsuit at worst. Anyway, whether or not America is a great example of the protection of freedom of speech is irrelevant. The FACT is that this blatant disregard for basic human freedoms by the Germans is NO different in principle from Nazism. The Germans might not pick on Jews anymore, but they still act like Nazis. Hitler arrested people for speaking their minds, and the German government still does the same. Wake up! Nazism is still alive and well in German government!
- Status
Silmarunya
Distinguished
- Nov 3, 2009
- 390
- 0
- 18,930
[citation][nom]flow-tilla[/nom]If we've learned anything in the 21st century, it's:Hitler rounding up the jews and killing them == badJews rounding up and killing the Palestinians == good[/citation]
I'm going to be devil's advocate for a second: Israel does not seek to systematically destroy every Palestinian alive.
What we're seeing there is something we're also seeing in Darfour and many other regions of the world:
Two peoples with a different way of life and a different culture that live in the same country. That's not a problem, there are lots of states like that. But there's something that complicates things: Israel/Palestine is overpopulated, lacks water for agriculture and personal use and features two distinct people competing over the same scarce soil and water. That's bound to go wrong.
Advanced agricultural techniques like drip-irrigation, often invented or at least imported by the Jews allowed the population to grow at a high pace to its current level. But now we've hit a wall. The Jordan is dry. Aquifer levels are dropping. Why do you think Israel's 'Safety Wall' encircles some of the last fertile and humid areas on the Palestinian side of the border?
It's an ugly fight for scarce resources and both sides are willing to go far. Unfortunately for th Palestines, Isreal has the technology and scientific knowledge to crush the Palestinians. Given its overwhelming power, they've even been rather gentle...
I'm going to be devil's advocate for a second: Israel does not seek to systematically destroy every Palestinian alive.
What we're seeing there is something we're also seeing in Darfour and many other regions of the world:
Two peoples with a different way of life and a different culture that live in the same country. That's not a problem, there are lots of states like that. But there's something that complicates things: Israel/Palestine is overpopulated, lacks water for agriculture and personal use and features two distinct people competing over the same scarce soil and water. That's bound to go wrong.
Advanced agricultural techniques like drip-irrigation, often invented or at least imported by the Jews allowed the population to grow at a high pace to its current level. But now we've hit a wall. The Jordan is dry. Aquifer levels are dropping. Why do you think Israel's 'Safety Wall' encircles some of the last fertile and humid areas on the Palestinian side of the border?
It's an ugly fight for scarce resources and both sides are willing to go far. Unfortunately for th Palestines, Isreal has the technology and scientific knowledge to crush the Palestinians. Given its overwhelming power, they've even been rather gentle...
Silmarunya
Distinguished
- Nov 3, 2009
- 390
- 0
- 18,930
[citation][nom]Xenophage[/nom]But it's not slander, and slander doesn't land you in jail in America. Libel, which is *factually inaccurate* slander might land you a lawsuit at worst. Anyway, whether or not America is a great example of the protection of freedom of speech is irrelevant. The FACT is that this blatant disregard for basic human freedoms by the Germans is NO different in principle from Nazism. The Germans might not pick on Jews anymore, but they still act like Nazis. Hitler arrested people for speaking their minds, and the German government still does the same. Wake up! Nazism is still alive and well in German government![/citation]
It's a common idea here in Europe that freedom of speech is not an absolute concept. It has a border and that border is hatred. Giving an opinion criticizing someone else is fine. Preaching hatred or even the eradication of someone else is a criminal offense and rightfully so.
Trying to prevent ideas based on hate for the other from taking root isn't Nazism. It's preventing Nazism or any other ideology based on oppression and hatred for the other can never again take root.
A key motto in German politics is 'Mit Einander. Für Einander. Nie wieder gegen Einander.' These words perfectly explain why this sort of hatred can't be tolerated.
It's a common idea here in Europe that freedom of speech is not an absolute concept. It has a border and that border is hatred. Giving an opinion criticizing someone else is fine. Preaching hatred or even the eradication of someone else is a criminal offense and rightfully so.
Trying to prevent ideas based on hate for the other from taking root isn't Nazism. It's preventing Nazism or any other ideology based on oppression and hatred for the other can never again take root.
A key motto in German politics is 'Mit Einander. Für Einander. Nie wieder gegen Einander.' These words perfectly explain why this sort of hatred can't be tolerated.
Silmarunya
Distinguished
- Nov 3, 2009
- 390
- 0
- 18,930
[citation][nom]back_by_demand[/nom]Very few? So there are some then.Let me guess, the Imams?[/citation]
How many Imams lectures have you heard? There are a few Imams preaching extremist ideas, just as their are Christians harboring extremist ideas. These are quickly arrested and more importantly, denounced by the vast majority of their colleagues.
Most Imams preach a moderate Islam, based on Zakat (charity) and respect for the other. Even when it comes to sexual morale they are far ahead of many Christians (how many clergymen encourage the use of condoms in public?)
Accusing all or even a majority of harboring extremist ideas is an extremist idea by itself...
How many Imams lectures have you heard? There are a few Imams preaching extremist ideas, just as their are Christians harboring extremist ideas. These are quickly arrested and more importantly, denounced by the vast majority of their colleagues.
Most Imams preach a moderate Islam, based on Zakat (charity) and respect for the other. Even when it comes to sexual morale they are far ahead of many Christians (how many clergymen encourage the use of condoms in public?)
Accusing all or even a majority of harboring extremist ideas is an extremist idea by itself...
Silmarunya
Distinguished
- Nov 3, 2009
- 390
- 0
- 18,930
[citation][nom]back_by_demand[/nom]All I heard there was[/citation]
I'm getting a strong feeling you never studied Islam in general, much less Islam in the West. But that's okay, you're probably one of these idiots who thinks the average Muslim is proud of Al Qaida.
But you're wrong. Most Muslim Imams even denounce Al Qaida and other scum on the margin. A Fatwa was recently written against them, and that's pretty heavy (the closest thing we have in Christianity would be a Papal Bull).
In the eyes of a normal Muslim, blowing yourself up and plotting to destroy the West is as acceptable as raping every single child we encounter in the street is to us.
I'm getting a strong feeling you never studied Islam in general, much less Islam in the West. But that's okay, you're probably one of these idiots who thinks the average Muslim is proud of Al Qaida.
But you're wrong. Most Muslim Imams even denounce Al Qaida and other scum on the margin. A Fatwa was recently written against them, and that's pretty heavy (the closest thing we have in Christianity would be a Papal Bull).
In the eyes of a normal Muslim, blowing yourself up and plotting to destroy the West is as acceptable as raping every single child we encounter in the street is to us.
flow-tilla :
If we've learned anything in the 21st century, it's:Hitler rounding up the jews and killing them == badJews rounding up and killing the Palestinians == good
I'm going to be devil's advocate for a second: Israel does not seek to systematically destroy every Palestinian alive.
No? Are you sure? I guess not
If we've learned anything in the 21st century, it's:Hitler rounding up the jews and killing them == badJews rounding up and killing the Palestinians == good
I'm going to be devil's advocate for a second: Israel does not seek to systematically destroy every Palestinian alive.
No? Are you sure? I guess not
sirmorluk
Distinguished
- Jul 16, 2009
- 74
- 0
- 18,580
[citation][nom]Silmarunya[/nom]It's somewhat understandable. For an American, European WW II is a rather far off thing that they didn't get involved in up close (no civilian casualties and the American role in Allied victory is next to nothing - Soviet Russia single handedly destroyed Germany with British air support).But for Germans, Hitler's terror is still very much alive. They dread Nazism. They suffered immensely due to it. And then someone thinks it's funny to play Hitler quotes in public? I'll start reciting the Quran during a Christian meeting. Or shout how America isn't socialist enough at a Tea Party meeting. That's how respectful it is...[/citation]
Wow! What a load of nonsense. No civilian casualties? Russia single handedly defeated? Please do some research before posting fallacies like this. I realize you have no knowledge of History but why not start by researching how many locomotives that Russia produced during the war which btw = 0 and then look at the American lend-lease program to Russia and England as well. Then take a look at the numbers of U.S. civilians dtained and killed in the PTO.
As an avid historian crap like this makes blood shoot out of my eyes.
Wow! What a load of nonsense. No civilian casualties? Russia single handedly defeated? Please do some research before posting fallacies like this. I realize you have no knowledge of History but why not start by researching how many locomotives that Russia produced during the war which btw = 0 and then look at the American lend-lease program to Russia and England as well. Then take a look at the numbers of U.S. civilians dtained and killed in the PTO.
As an avid historian crap like this makes blood shoot out of my eyes.
Silmarunya
Distinguished
- Nov 3, 2009
- 390
- 0
- 18,930
[citation][nom]floc[/nom]flow-tilla :If we've learned anything in the 21st century, it's:Hitler rounding up the jews and killing them == badJews rounding up and killing the Palestinians == goodI'm going to be devil's advocate for a second: Israel does not seek to systematically destroy every Palestinian alive.No? Are you sure? I guess not[/citation]
/citation]
1) Quoting the first line of a post is lame. A post is coherent list of arguments that need to be together to make a point.
2) Yes, I'm sure. Israel could have easily destroyed every single Palestine with ease, but guess what, they didn't. They even offer millions of them a home...
I'm not saying Israel is holy, but the Palestinians have too much blood on their hands too to be worth defending... Both sides are so out of line it's impossible to say: 'that's the good guy, the other is the evil one'.
/citation]
1) Quoting the first line of a post is lame. A post is coherent list of arguments that need to be together to make a point.
2) Yes, I'm sure. Israel could have easily destroyed every single Palestine with ease, but guess what, they didn't. They even offer millions of them a home...
I'm not saying Israel is holy, but the Palestinians have too much blood on their hands too to be worth defending... Both sides are so out of line it's impossible to say: 'that's the good guy, the other is the evil one'.
The Greater Good
Distinguished
- Jan 14, 2010
- 115
- 0
- 18,630
[citation][nom]Silmarunya[/nom]It's somewhat understandable. For an American, European WW II is a rather far off thing that they didn't get involved in up close (no civilian casualties and the American role in Allied victory is next to nothing - Soviet Russia single handedly destroyed Germany with British air support).[/citation]
"Didn't get involved in up close"... yeah, I guess Normandy, France is not part of Europe. Who knew?
"Didn't get involved in up close"... yeah, I guess Normandy, France is not part of Europe. Who knew?
[citation][nom]Silmarunya[/nom]Wait? America is the shining beacon of free speech?I guess the Patriot Act never happened. I guess communists are allowed to speak freely. I guess a homosexual can freely show his affinity in public and can even marry his partner?Oh wait, that's in Europe.[/citation]
Right, homosexual "marriage" is exactly the same thing as freedom of speech. Right. Get a clue, please.
Right, homosexual "marriage" is exactly the same thing as freedom of speech. Right. Get a clue, please.
sirmorluk
Distinguished
- Jul 16, 2009
- 74
- 0
- 18,580
[citation][nom]the greater good[/nom]"Didn't get involved in up close"... yeah, I guess Normandy, France is not part of Europe. Who knew?[/citation]
Sicily, Italy, N. Africa, Belguim, Holland, Luxembourg, Austria, France, New Guinea, The Philipines, China, Burma, The Solomons, The Marshals, Iwo Jima, Okinawa, The Carolinas, the list goes on and on...
Sicily, Italy, N. Africa, Belguim, Holland, Luxembourg, Austria, France, New Guinea, The Philipines, China, Burma, The Solomons, The Marshals, Iwo Jima, Okinawa, The Carolinas, the list goes on and on...
jj463rd
Distinguished
- Apr 9, 2008
- 139
- 0
- 18,640
[citation][nom]Silmarunya[/nom]It's somewhat understandable. For an American, European WW II is a rather far off thing that they didn't get involved in up close (no civilian casualties and the American role in Allied victory is next to nothing - Soviet Russia single handedly destroyed Germany with British air support).[/citation]
That's quite a lopsided viewpoint since my father had 50 combat missions as a Pilot on B-17's over Italy,France,Austria(part of the greater German reich),Germany,Romania,Yugoslavia,Hungary,Czechoslovakia and Greece.Also my uncle entered Germany as a mortar team leader and helped in the liberation of Ohrdruf.
That's quite a lopsided viewpoint since my father had 50 combat missions as a Pilot on B-17's over Italy,France,Austria(part of the greater German reich),Germany,Romania,Yugoslavia,Hungary,Czechoslovakia and Greece.Also my uncle entered Germany as a mortar team leader and helped in the liberation of Ohrdruf.
That guy deserved to be arrested. Along with broadcasting hate, people on the train should not be forced to listen to his crap over and over again.
I say German people are very peacefull because they put up with him until the police arrived instead of throwing his phone out the window.
I say German people are very peacefull because they put up with him until the police arrived instead of throwing his phone out the window.
Wow am I still reading THG? I have to say something though....
1- While I would love to say "freedom is absolute" and this guy has rights too, I guess if I was a Jew on that train with him I probably would have STRONG feelings against his ringtone.
2- LOL @ Soviets winning WWII with some help from UK and little from US.
3-
1- While I would love to say "freedom is absolute" and this guy has rights too, I guess if I was a Jew on that train with him I probably would have STRONG feelings against his ringtone.
2- LOL @ Soviets winning WWII with some help from UK and little from US.
3-
Silmarunya
Distinguished
- Nov 3, 2009
- 390
- 0
- 18,930
[citation][nom]sirmorluk[/nom]Wow! What a load of nonsense. No civilian casualties? Russia single handedly defeated? Please do some research before posting fallacies like this. I realize you have no knowledge of History but why not start by researching how many locomotives that Russia produced during the war which btw = 0 and then look at the American lend-lease program to Russia and England as well. Then take a look at the numbers of U.S. civilians dtained and killed in the PTO. As an avid historian crap like this makes blood shoot out of my eyes.[/citation]
Roughly 3 million German soldiers died on the Eastern Front. Less than a million on the Western. Who contributed most to Germany's defeat then?
The number of American soldiers involved in the war was dwarfed by those deployed by Russia. German tank commanders mocked the poorly designed Sherman Tank and feared the excellent and easily mass-produced T34.
Normandy was pretty easy. Most of the western troops had already been moved to the Eastern Front by D-Day.
America's material contribution cannot be disputed, it was indeed vital for both Britain and Russia (and conveniently helped slumping American industry, but that's not relevant here). However, the effort of sending lots of material is less then the effort of losing 25 million countrymen like Russia had to endure.
Roughly 3 million German soldiers died on the Eastern Front. Less than a million on the Western. Who contributed most to Germany's defeat then?
The number of American soldiers involved in the war was dwarfed by those deployed by Russia. German tank commanders mocked the poorly designed Sherman Tank and feared the excellent and easily mass-produced T34.
Normandy was pretty easy. Most of the western troops had already been moved to the Eastern Front by D-Day.
America's material contribution cannot be disputed, it was indeed vital for both Britain and Russia (and conveniently helped slumping American industry, but that's not relevant here). However, the effort of sending lots of material is less then the effort of losing 25 million countrymen like Russia had to endure.
Silmarunya
Distinguished
- Nov 3, 2009
- 390
- 0
- 18,930
[citation][nom]wotan31[/nom]Right, homosexual "marriage" is exactly the same thing as freedom of speech. Right. Get a clue, please.[/citation]
Yup. Expressing who you are is an integral part of freedom of speech. If you are homosexual, the freedom to openly express that is part of your free speech. And good job picking one random argument btw...
Yup. Expressing who you are is an integral part of freedom of speech. If you are homosexual, the freedom to openly express that is part of your free speech. And good job picking one random argument btw...
Silmarunya
Distinguished
- Nov 3, 2009
- 390
- 0
- 18,930
[citation][nom]the greater good[/nom]"Didn't get involved in up close"... yeah, I guess Normandy, France is not part of Europe. Who knew?[/citation]
Storming a poorly defended coastline that was poorly defended because most troops were already desperately trying to hold back Stalin's superior armies wasn't much of a challenge...
Storming a poorly defended coastline that was poorly defended because most troops were already desperately trying to hold back Stalin's superior armies wasn't much of a challenge...
- Status
Similar threads
TRENDING THREADS
-
-
-
Question Best laptops for a student going to high school
- Started by joninte2
- Replies: 2
-
-
Discussion What new phone technology trends should we keep an eye on?- Started by Vandna Jadhav
- Replies: 2
-
Question What if the EU forced laptop makers to allow upgradeable ram and storage?
- Started by kionbo2
- Replies: 2
-
Facebook
Twitter