Canon Rebel 350D/Rebel XT vs Nikon D70

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On Wed, 02 Mar 2005 20:13:45 +1100, Alain Picard
<Alain.Picard@memetrics.com> wrote:

>"Skip M" <shadowcatcher@cox.net> writes:
>
>> The lack of spot meter kept me out of the DSLR game for a long time, but it
>> became apparent that Canon wasn't going to produce a sub $2000 DSLR with it,
>> so I relented. I still miss it, to me it was invaluable for portrait work,
>> but others seem to have adjusted well, I can, too. In the meantime, I'm
>> saving up nickels and dimes for a 1 series body...
>
>I'm thinking of buying a 350D (the price seems right). I'm wondering:
>is it possible to come in very close to the subject (making matrix
>metering equivalent to spot), read out the exposure reading, then
>"fix" them, somehow (even by turning to full manual mode, if necessary)?
>
>i.e. can one read the shutter/aperture the camera intends to use
>on this camera? For portraits, this might be a suitable compromise.
>
>--ap
The answer is yes, it shows these in the viewfinder.
http/www.dpreview.com/articles/canoneos350d/page2.asp
Look for "Viewfinder Info".
It's also on the lCD panel on the back.
--
Bill Funk
Change "g" to "a"

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On Wed, 02 Mar 2005 20:13:45 +1100, Alain Picard
<Alain.Picard@memetrics.com> wrote:

>"Skip M" <shadowcatcher@cox.net> writes:
>
>> The lack of spot meter kept me out of the DSLR game for a long time, but it
>> became apparent that Canon wasn't going to produce a sub $2000 DSLR with it,
>> so I relented. I still miss it, to me it was invaluable for portrait work,
>> but others seem to have adjusted well, I can, too. In the meantime, I'm
>> saving up nickels and dimes for a 1 series body...
>
>I'm thinking of buying a 350D (the price seems right). I'm wondering:
>is it possible to come in very close to the subject (making matrix
>metering equivalent to spot), read out the exposure reading, then
>"fix" them, somehow (even by turning to full manual mode, if necessary)?
>
>i.e. can one read the shutter/aperture the camera intends to use
>on this camera? For portraits, this might be a suitable compromise.

A guess, rather than from experience, but if you're using flash(es), I
could imagine the camera getting things wrong because you're closer to the
subject and the camera will think the strobes will have more effect than
they will from the correct shooting distance. If you're using non-flash
lights, this shouldn't matter, provided you don't block (too much) light as
you move in close to meter.


Regards,
Graham Holden (g-holden AT dircon DOT co DOT uk)
--
There are 10 types of people in the world;
those that understand binary and those that don't.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Alain Picard" <Alain.Picard@memetrics.com> wrote in message
news:878y569zqu.fsf@memetrics.com...
> "Skip M" <shadowcatcher@cox.net> writes:
>
>> The lack of spot meter kept me out of the DSLR game for a long time, but
>> it
>> became apparent that Canon wasn't going to produce a sub $2000 DSLR with
>> it,
>> so I relented. I still miss it, to me it was invaluable for portrait
>> work,
>> but others seem to have adjusted well, I can, too. In the meantime, I'm
>> saving up nickels and dimes for a 1 series body...
>
> I'm thinking of buying a 350D (the price seems right). I'm wondering:
> is it possible to come in very close to the subject (making matrix
> metering equivalent to spot), read out the exposure reading, then
> "fix" them, somehow (even by turning to full manual mode, if necessary)?
>
> i.e. can one read the shutter/aperture the camera intends to use
> on this camera? For portraits, this might be a suitable compromise.
>
> --ap

Yes it is, using the partial spot metering, and linking the AE lock to one
of the buttons on the back so the focus lock and exposure lock are
independent of each other.

--
Skip Middleton
http/www.shadowcatcherimagery.com

 

[bill]

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Alain Picard wrote:

>> The lack of spot meter kept me out of the DSLR game for a long time, but it
>> became apparent that Canon wasn't going to produce a sub $2000 DSLR with it,
>> so I relented. I still miss it, to me it was invaluable for portrait work,
>> but others seem to have adjusted well, I can, too. In the meantime, I'm
>> saving up nickels and dimes for a 1 series body...
>
>I'm thinking of buying a 350D (the price seems right). I'm wondering:
>is it possible to come in very close to the subject (making matrix
>metering equivalent to spot), read out the exposure reading, then
>"fix" them, somehow (even by turning to full manual mode, if necessary)?

Even though the 350D/XT doesn't have a spot meter, it does have a 9%
partial meter which is effectively a large spot meter. The only
difference between a spot and partial, is the amount of area that is
covered by the meter.

So if you want to spot meter your subject, just use the partial setting
and it will work fine 95% of the time as is. For the few situations that
you need to get a finer meter reading, simply move in a little, use the
AE lock and then recompose the view. No big deal.

>i.e. can one read the shutter/aperture the camera intends to use
>on this camera? For portraits, this might be a suitable compromise.

Yes. The viewfinder has all the typical info like shutter speed,
aperture, focus lock, exposure compensation, etc.

If you want details and images, visit DPReview and select the reviews on
the left side.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

In article <878y569zqu.fsf@memetrics.com>, Alain.Picard@memetrics.com
says...
> I'm thinking of buying a 350D (the price seems right). I'm wondering:
> is it possible to come in very close to the subject (making matrix
> metering equivalent to spot), read out the exposure reading, then
> "fix" them, somehow (even by turning to full manual mode, if necessary)?
>
> i.e. can one read the shutter/aperture the camera intends to use
> on this camera? For portraits, this might be a suitable compromise.

It's a lot easier just to bracket and judge exposure by the histogram.
Then you can set your exposure compensation and shoot away.
--
http/www.pbase.com/bcbaird/

 

[bill]

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Alan Browne wrote:

>There's no reason a live preview can't be implemented on a DSLR,

As has been mentioned before, the mirror and shutter are in the way of
the sensor. They would have to be moved or modified in order for the
sensor to give a live image.

>appears that the 20Da has just that.

The 20DA has modifications that allows the preview primarily for
astrophotography. The shutter can be held open like bulb mode, and the
mirror is more translucent, allowing more light to transfer to the
sensor. This allows the user to use the LCD to preview shots from the
telescope without having to peek through the viewfinder, which can be a
hassle.

>I will bet that the next gen of DSLR's will begin to have preview modes
>complete with histos, clip/blocking cues, etc.

I don't think most users of DSLR cameras need that info prior to the
shot. If they did, they wouldn't know enough about photography to use a
DSLR.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Bill wrote:

> Alan Browne wrote:
>
>
>>There's no reason a live preview can't be implemented on a DSLR,
>
>
> As has been mentioned before, the mirror and shutter are in the way of
> the sensor. They would have to be moved or modified in order for the
> sensor to give a live image.

Well, duh. (See prior posts). It would be no big deal to implement this.

>
>
>>appears that the 20Da has just that.
>
>
> The 20DA has modifications that allows the preview primarily for
> astrophotography. The shutter can be held open like bulb mode, and the
> mirror is more translucent, allowing more light to transfer to the
> sensor. This allows the user to use the LCD to preview shots from the
> telescope without having to peek through the viewfinder, which can be a
> hassle.

Are you sure about the lens being more translucent? (ref?) Doesn't it
just flip up. As long as you're opening the shutter for this mode
lifting the mirror is no big deal.

>
>
>>I will bet that the next gen of DSLR's will begin to have preview modes
>>complete with histos, clip/blocking cues, etc.
>
>
> I don't think most users of DSLR cameras need that info prior to the
> shot. If they did, they wouldn't know enough about photography to use a
> DSLR.

Were that statement true, there would be no need of a monitor at all on
a DSLR. Just record what's shot and wait until you get back to the
computer. ... like waiting for the film to be processed.

In effect, it is costless to take a shot and examine it, esp. if the
camera provides indications of blocking up and clipping, make
adjustments, delete the test image, and then fire away. OTOH, a mode
for the purpose could lead to faster setup and less file management.

Cheers,
Alan

--
-- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http/www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm
-- r.p.d.slr-systems: http/www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm
-- [SI] gallery & rulz: http/www.pbase.com/shootin
-- e-meil: there's no such thing as a FreeLunch.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

In article <I_idnRp0Mt4s3rrfRVn-rQ@golden.net>, Bill <bill@c.a> wrote:
>Alan Browne wrote:

[ ... ]

>I have a P&S digital camera as well as SLR's, and even though I can view
>with the LCD, I rarely use it that way. The LCD is there to verify
>focus, composure, exposure level, etc., so you don't have to wait to see
>the images on a computer. You can decide if it's a keeper right there.

I have a P&S (Nikon CoolPix 950) in addition to the SLRs and
DSLRs. I find that viewing through the LCD is particularly nice when
you need to get a view somewhere where it would be awkward to place the
camera and yourself in a straight line. An example which came up
recently was under the pedestal of a lathe on which I was working.
(Yes, I had to lay on my back and work overhead -- but there was not
sufficient room for both me and the owner of the lathe to do so at the
same time so I could explain things to him.

Another place where the swivel full-time LCD viewfinder is nice
is when taking photos from within the middle of a crowd. On my old
Miranda F, and on the Nikon F, with a folding viewfinder I could hold
the camera upside down over my head, and compose looking up into the
focusing screen. I cannot do this with either the N90s or the D70,
because the finder is not removable. But the CoolPix 950 allows me to
do this without problems. (Now -- getting quick exposures is a
different matter. Hmm ... for that -- perhaps a remote LCD
viewfinder on a cable so I could look at it more closely would help even
more.

Another place where the swivel viewfinder is nice is when
photographing children at play from a child's view height. Yes, I can
kneel down to do it, but getting back up is more difficult these days.

But I still prefer the D70 for most of what I do.

Enjoy,
DoN.
--
Email: <dnichols@d-and-d.com> | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http/www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Brian C. Baird <nospam@please.no> writes:

>
> It's a lot easier just to bracket and judge exposure by the histogram.
> Then you can set your exposure compensation and shoot away.

Ah! Yes, of course. Shows my lack of "digital" experience...
didn't have no histograms on my old Ricoh XR-1.

Thanks! I'm looking forward to using this camera (a lot!)

--
It would be difficult to construe Larry Wall, in article
this as a feature. <1995May29.062427.3640@netlabs.com>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Big Bill <bill@pipping.com> writes:

> The answer is yes, it shows these in the viewfinder.
> http/www.dpreview.com/articles/canoneos350d/page2.asp

Ah yes!. Thank you very much. That's exactly what I was
hoping for.

--
It would be difficult to construe Larry Wall, in article
this as a feature. <1995May29.062427.3640@netlabs.com>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On Wed, 02 Mar 2005 20:13:45 +1100, Alain Picard
<Alain.Picard@memetrics.com> wrote:

>"Skip M" <shadowcatcher@cox.net> writes:
>
>> The lack of spot meter kept me out of the DSLR game for a long time, but it
>> became apparent that Canon wasn't going to produce a sub $2000 DSLR with it,
>> so I relented. I still miss it, to me it was invaluable for portrait work,
>> but others seem to have adjusted well, I can, too. In the meantime, I'm
>> saving up nickels and dimes for a 1 series body...
>
>I'm thinking of buying a 350D (the price seems right). I'm wondering:
>is it possible to come in very close to the subject (making matrix
>metering equivalent to spot), read out the exposure reading, then
>"fix" them, somehow (even by turning to full manual mode, if necessary)?

The D70 (with 18-70 lens) at about $900 after the $200 rebate seems
like a better deal than the Rebels, unless you got a lot tied up in
Canon lenses.
>
>i.e. can one read the shutter/aperture the camera intends to use
>on this camera? For portraits, this might be a suitable compromise.
>
>--ap

 

[MarkH]

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

dnichols@d-and-d.com (DoN. Nichols) wrote in
news:d07o9u$eq2$1@fuego.d-and-d.com:

> Another place where the swivel full-time LCD viewfinder is nice
> is when taking photos from within the middle of a crowd. On my old
> Miranda F, and on the Nikon F, with a folding viewfinder I could hold
> the camera upside down over my head, and compose looking up into the
> focusing screen. I cannot do this with either the N90s or the D70,
> because the finder is not removable. But the CoolPix 950 allows me to
> do this without problems. (Now -- getting quick exposures is a
> different matter. Hmm ... for that -- perhaps a remote LCD
> viewfinder on a cable so I could look at it more closely would help
> even more.
>
> Another place where the swivel viewfinder is nice is when
> photographing children at play from a child's view height. Yes, I can
> kneel down to do it, but getting back up is more difficult these days.
>

I can't help wondering how hard it would be to have a sensor that clips on
to the viewfinder of a D-SLR and has a swivel LCD attached. Or how about
an attached visor that you wear at the end of a cable. This would allow
for composing the image with the camera held in any position you liked and
would not require redesigning the SLR or replacing the sensor with one
designed for live video output. There would be no compromise of image
quality at all, the only thing you couldn’t do very well would be manual
focus (unless the system had extremely high res, which would probably make
it extremely expensive).


--
Mark Heyes (New Zealand)
See my pics at www.gigatech.co.nz (last updated 20-Jan-05)
"There are 10 types of people, those that
understand binary and those that don't"

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

MarkH wrote:
> dnichols@d-and-d.com (DoN. Nichols) wrote in
> news:d07o9u$eq2$1@fuego.d-and-d.com:
>
>
>> Another place where the swivel full-time LCD viewfinder is nice
>>is when taking photos from within the middle of a crowd. On my old
>>Miranda F, and on the Nikon F, with a folding viewfinder I could hold
>>the camera upside down over my head, and compose looking up into the
>>focusing screen. I cannot do this with either the N90s or the D70,
>>because the finder is not removable. But the CoolPix 950 allows me to
>>do this without problems. (Now -- getting quick exposures is a
>>different matter. Hmm ... for that -- perhaps a remote LCD
>>viewfinder on a cable so I could look at it more closely would help
>>even more.
>>
>> Another place where the swivel viewfinder is nice is when
>>photographing children at play from a child's view height. Yes, I can
>>kneel down to do it, but getting back up is more difficult these days.
>>
>
>
> I can't help wondering how hard it would be to have a sensor that clips on
> to the viewfinder of a D-SLR and has a swivel LCD attached. Or how about
> an attached visor that you wear at the end of a cable. This would allow
> for composing the image with the camera held in any position you liked and
> would not require redesigning the SLR or replacing the sensor with one
> designed for live video output. There would be no compromise of image
> quality at all, the only thing you couldn’t do very well would be manual
> focus (unless the system had extremely high res, which would probably make
> it extremely expensive).

Like a Wi-Fi (802.11 or small-band RF) HMD[1]? That would be interesting.

1. <http/www.i-glassesstore.com/hmds.html>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

In article <TYqdnSThBtK1XrvfRVn-1w@golden.net>, bill@c.a says...
> The 20DA has modifications that allows the preview primarily for
> astrophotography. The shutter can be held open like bulb mode, and the
> mirror is more translucent, allowing more light to transfer to the
> sensor. This allows the user to use the LCD to preview shots from the
> telescope without having to peek through the viewfinder, which can be a
> hassle.

Actually, the mirror has to be locked up for the LCD preview to work on
the 20Da.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

In article <SfKVd.157433$Zm5.20868@news.easynews.com>,
markat@atdot.dot.dot says...
> I can't help wondering how hard it would be to have a sensor that clips on
> to the viewfinder of a D-SLR and has a swivel LCD attached.

Well, the sensor would have to be very small, which means it would be a
noisy little beast considering how small the photosites would be and how
much signal amplification it would require. If it was monochromatic,
I'd imagine it would be easier to implement - but it would still chew up
batteries.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

In article <MPG.1c91432bdbab48c898a738@news.verizon.net>,
Brian Baird <no@yeah.right> wrote:
>In article <SfKVd.157433$Zm5.20868@news.easynews.com>,
>markat@atdot.dot.dot says...
>> I can't help wondering how hard it would be to have a sensor that clips on
>> to the viewfinder of a D-SLR and has a swivel LCD attached.
>
>Well, the sensor would have to be very small, which means it would be a
>noisy little beast considering how small the photosites would be and how
>much signal amplification it would require. If it was monochromatic,
>I'd imagine it would be easier to implement - but it would still chew up
>batteries.

But it would chew up its *own* batteries, as I see no practical
way to (or reason to) power it from the camera's batteries. And I would
suggest mounting the batteries separate from the sensor -- though
it could possibly be co-located with the display if the display is
remote. The visor suggestion strikes me as nice. (Though it would take
some time to build up the proper reflexes for tracking moving things at
some strange angle to the body.)

The way I see it -- at least for a single camera model -- is the
tiny TV (viewfinding) camera would be mounted in the flash shoe, and a
flip-up optical relay would redirect the image from the viewfinder up to
the viewfinding camera. That way, you could swing it aside to use the
viewfinder normally. And when the relay lens was flipped up, it should
turn off power to the viewfinding camera to conserve battery life.

Hmm ... why not have an insert in one corner of the display
which would be a magnified section of the center of the image for better
manual focusing -- though I suspect that autofocus would be the better
choice for much of this.

Whether I would ever actually *buy* something of this sort would
depend on price, and how much I needed it.

Enjoy,
DoN.
--
Email: <dnichols@d-and-d.com> | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http/www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

 

[MarkH]

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Brian Baird <no@yeah.right> wrote in
news:MPG.1c91432bdbab48c898a738@news.verizon.net:

> In article <SfKVd.157433$Zm5.20868@news.easynews.com>,
> markat@atdot.dot.dot says...
>> I can't help wondering how hard it would be to have a sensor that
>> clips on to the viewfinder of a D-SLR and has a swivel LCD attached.
>
> Well, the sensor would have to be very small, which means it would be
> a noisy little beast considering how small the photosites would be and
> how much signal amplification it would require.

Noisy? It only needs to produce a low res image for the LCD so that you
can compose the image, you would need no more res than the LCD can display.



--
Mark Heyes (New Zealand)
See my pics at www.gigatech.co.nz (last updated 20-Jan-05)
"There are 10 types of people, those that
understand binary and those that don't"

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Mark Bayliff via PhotoKB.com wrote:
> Steven,
>
> Do you have any info RE the aftermarket grip available for the D70?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Mark
>
> --
> Message posted via http/www.photokb.com

Looks like it'll be ready for sale in a few weeks, see:
"http/www.harbortronics.com/news.htm"

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Steven,

Do you have any info RE the aftermarket grip available for the D70?

Thanks!

Mark

--
Message posted via http/www.photokb.com

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Hi Photobug,

I'm looking at the D70 and new Rebel 350 XT - my concern is the moire.

What is your or anyone's experience with your/their D70?

Thanks!

Mark

I like to take pictures of trains and I don't want the handrails and edges
to look dotted (as they do with my Fuji S7000 @6PM)

--
Message posted via http/www.photokb.com