Epic's Mike Capps: Apps Are Killing Us

[roleki]

[citation][nom]Anaxamenes[/nom]I think a lot of those app games are going to people who wouldn't normally play console games anyways. They aren't taking away dollars from consoles, they are introducing new players to gaming. What is needed is some good apps that help those new gamers find games they would like on consoles, probably through making a good, short app game that leads into a bigger story. But it all boils down to making a good game. People buy good games, but it's a lot harder to pony up $60 if you unsure if the game is worth it.[/citation]

Agree completely. Cheap apps are not a negative - the only markets they cannibalize are their own.

 

[greeve]

Adapt now or become irrelevant alla Blockbuster!

 

[memadmax]

"Micro Games" are a fad. Once people get tired of 20 or more of them that all are pretty much the same (Zynga is horrible at this) people will migrate back...

 

[getochkn]

It's not just the cost but what you get for the cost. These games coming out have 8-12h single player time and you've cleared the game, then what do you? Who wants to play the same mission over when you already know it. Opened ended games like GTA at least give you good value, you can play for weeks and not complete everything or just play around and interact with the environment. Some have shoddy multiplayer, they don't put enough servers up, take forever for patches, abandon the game after a year and there are no more servers or patches to play on, riddled with cheaters and hackers.

 

[sozoc2k]

[citation][nom]festerovic[/nom]In a down economy, don't read too much into declining sales as a precursor for industry movement. Maybe there just isn't as much disposable income for wants like games, or there hasn't been as much compelling software.[/citation]

This pretty much sums up why traditional gaming has seen lower sales. Lots of people lost their jobs, got pay cuts, or graduated and can't find jobs. When it comes down to it, $59.99 + tax is something you can pass on when your trying to eat or pay rent. Notice he said the past 2 years. He simply forgot that globally, everyone had a slam, and certain things have to be cut back. As for apple, they revolutionized nothing or brought anything to the table. I was playing games on my cellphone before they ever brought the Iphone, Ipad or whatever one wants to point too. I do not view apple as an innovator, merely a refiner of already good ideas.

 

[mdillenbeck]

Its not that the apps are cheap - its that there are cheap free apps that can be played quickly, are entertaining, and some even have good replay value. Why would I pay $60 for a single "cinematic" video game often time only at beta level quality on release and has 5 hours of playtime and no replay value.

 

[Kileak]

Pay to play games like MMORPGs are doing good if you look at WoW, Rift and the others, ok maybe not all of them but the ones that do understand the addiction and are exploiting it are doing well.

Perhaps invest in making quality games that people will actually enjoy playing for more than a Saturday afternoon, and recommend to their friends etc.

But even then, the players are what makes a game reach out. If nobody was playing Team Fortress 2, it wouldn't be such a hit, but people just keep playing it, even after it's been out for so long!

Out of all of them, EPIC should know, Unreal Tournament classic is still up and running for probably more people than their latest installment...

In the end, all it is, and Nintendo knows this, gameplay > graphics. Spend less money on the graphics and more time making sure the game is actually a game, the people buying it will play it, and because they're playing it more will buy it, and then more.

 

[dread_cthulhu]

Sigh... I've officially ceased all gaming except old school console stuff... So sick of the social/multiplayer/MUST BE ONLINE aspects... Who wants to interact with real people while they game? Not I!

 

[Zingam]

Come on! I've tried few times to play first person shooters with a gamepad - the experience just sux and first person shooters are stupid mostly.

The problem is not Apple. The problem is that the companies make stupid crappy games. There are so few really original games that do it right. Most are just copies/clones of older ones.

And also of course sales in the past two years will decline and the reason is not the world crysis. If most gamers buy a console released in 2005/2006 how many years will they play it before it gets old and boring?


There are too many game developers and too little good titles. That's why sales will decline. Bad products = bad sales.

 

[kinggraves]

We've heard the same story from ECGC all week that cloud gaming and micro games are the next fad. ECGC is run primarily by Epic and devs friendly to Epic. Epic is now putting out micro games.

For those of you who can't put the pieces together, ECGC is one long commercial for Epic and their future ventures. They want you to think this is the future because it's their future. And who is really surprised? Most of these dev teams are the same ones that left PC gaming for consoles, why wouldn't they run off to the next cash cow?

Epic doesn't determine the future of gaming, and they especially can't comment at all on consoles since they're the new fish in the console industry. If they want to piece together why they aren't selling games on consoles anymore, they might want to take a look at how that industry runs and realize they can't just release games that focus on graphics on hardware that's over 5 years stale and expect everyone to consume it. You can't depend on graphics when it comes to consoles.

"How do you sell someone a $60 game that's really worth it ... They're used to 99 cents."
is probably the most incorrect thing said so far. Most games have been $50+ new off the shelf for 30 years, that's what people were used to. If they aren't used to it anymore, it's because the industry slipped up. The problem isn't that you're selling a 50 dollar game and they're selling a one dollar game, the problem is that your 50 dollar game is only worth one dollar. If you would release games that are WORTH $50 then people will pay it.

But it's fine. Epic isn't really worth much more than reselling their engines anyway. If they think just because they're failing everyone is, they're as overconfident as their name implies. Companies like Nintendo and Square/Enix can re-release 10 year old games and still sell a million, they aren't going anywhere.

 

[Jarmo]

The obvious correction:

How do you sell someone a $60 game that's not really worth it ... They're used to 99 cents.

 

[NightLight]

make me a game that's worth playing, single player, with an actual STORY instead of a random fps. Think GTA4, where the whole game is a story, no matter in what order you play the missions. World freedom is key. What good are those fancy graphics when you don't have anywhere to go but a narrow one way path? Make me a x-wing type game, an actual space sim, not an "out of the cockpit" view. make it so every keyboard button controls something. those are the games we are waiting to buy. Sales will pick up sooo fast! There's hardly a game worth buying these days.

 

[greliu]

Economy sucks, games aren't as good, and these games AREN'T eating into the console or pc market since these people are the new upcoming "casual" gamers that play a game while waiting to place an order or on a 15 min work break. I wish I could make money talking about this crap.

 

[meberhart]

Of course apps are now infringing upon the big gaming consoles,...apps are both newer (often updatable) and priced more affordably (from $4.99 to FREE on average). For me, the reason that I am not buying games for consoles anymore is because consoles have gotten old,...literally. In fact, the last console I purchased was the original Xbox (actually, it was a gift from my wife) and though I loved the games on it (Halo, Elder Scrolls, Madden) and played it to death it could never compare to my PC versions of the game which I could mod and overclock the daylights out of! Ultimately, I was the kind of buyer who, in the end, opted to buy games for the PC only.

The problem with games on the PC, though, is that developers often design their game(s) for one of the big three consoles and then port over the game to the PC. Developers no longer push the bar to greater heights. Instead, they are happy living in the DirectX 9 & 10 world and don't bother with 11 at all since console platforms like the Wii don't support them! I can't remember the last time a game really pushed my PC core temperature [ed. - actually, it was probably Oblivion with the 250+ mods and maxed-out screen resolution,...but that was a while ago. I have since upgraded, though with the crappy games coming out I have to wonder why I bothered?].

Bottom line: with the exception of Portal 2 (which I purchased simply for the physics, puzzles and quirky commentary) I haven't bought a regular game that I simply felt I "had to have", anymore. I'm buying more Blu-rays, 3D at that, and other things that I feel I get more use out of to satisfy my inner geek. Modern games are leaving me feeling that I'm being deprived of the true potential out there. So I "buy" apps, which may not have the graphic interface of my Hi-Def TV but are at least new and cheap. Truthfully, though, since I am on the android platform, even games like Angry Birds can be downloaded FREE and I have yet to pay for an app that I couldn't live without or that some other app couldn't do in whole or in part.

When I think of modern gaming now, I cringe. I still like to play my old systems (Intellivision, Nintendo, Super NES, N64, Xbox, and such) but I do that for nostalgia here and there. I no longer devote whole days to console/PC games because they, too, feel more nostalgic than current anymore [ed. - with the exception of Portal 2, again. I put in 9 hours on the game and have beaten the single player version, though I've yet to try the Co-op mode].

Developers, please start innovating again. If Microsoft, Sony and Nintendo do not have the hardware to support your criteria for making a good game, then just make it for the Mac or PC! You're shooting yourselves by dumbing down your games just to get them on a gaming console. Trust me! If you make a game that pushes the envelope, raises the bar and that console manufacturer's CAN'T support on their console then they WILL come around once they see all the money that they are losing out on. Meanwhile, you (as a Developer) will get praise and glory from the gaming community and save your business! No one will say, "Yeah, it was a fun enough game but could've been better". You won't be stuck with a bad rep for making lame games. You'll be king of the (gaming) world!!!

Another thing,...app developers continue to release updates to their games (often FREE,...again, see Angry Birds) and support their growth. Major Developers tend to put their game out, *maybe* provide some DLC that you pay an arm and a leg for (really, $5 dollars for Horse Armor in Oblivion???), and then move on to other things. No wonder people get tired of your game! If you're already moving on, why should they stick around with it?

Seriously, though, if given a choice between playing an app on an iPhone or Android and playing a console game, then I would go for the console game if both were priced closer together. I really WANT to buy games for the PC/Console,...but you Dev's aren't making it easy for me!

/End Rant

 

[Yuka]

When you think about "consumed time" and "laziness", well... Consoles and PCs have little to nothing against those 2 combined and I'll be willing to say that Ultra Portables (smartphones and tablets; the second in a lesser manner) have the upper hand in that. Lazy people is lazy: the usual 80/20 remark. I'd say 80% not willing to go to the living room, turn on the TV+Console/PC and play and 20% willing to just play whenever they have battery left on the phone.

Besides, producing costs of AAA games have gone stupidly high over the last few years thanks to MS and Sony (Windows-PCs are common base here) and since they don't add THAT much fun experience per time (yes PER TIME) over a .99c game, they're pretty much doomed. So, Either consoles die and PC becomes the unified platform for devs OR they switch the focus of AAA production costs and just lower them (cheap games CAN be as fun as a 60 bucks one without the ridiculous cost). Microsoft can be a good ecosystem for games, but their greediness is so damn stupidly big, they won't MAKE IT easy.

Cheers!

 

[meberhart]

Of course apps are now infringing upon the big gaming consoles,...apps are both newer (often updatable) and priced more affordably (from $4.99 to FREE on average). For me, the reason that I am not buying games for consoles anymore is because consoles have gotten old,...literally. In fact, the last console I purchased was the original Xbox (actually, it was a gift from my wife) and though I loved the games on it (Halo, Elder Scrolls, Madden) and played it to death it could never compare to my PC versions of the game which I could mod and overclock the daylights out of! Ultimately, I was the kind of buyer who, in the end, opted to buy games for the PC only.

The problem with games on the PC, though, is that developers often design their game(s) for one of the big three consoles and then port over the game to the PC. Developers no longer push the bar to greater heights. Instead, they are happy living in the DirectX 9 & 10 world and don't bother with 11 at all since console platforms like the Wii don't support them! I can't remember the last time a game really pushed my PC core temperature [ed. - actually, it was probably Oblivion with the 250+ mods and maxed-out screen resolution,...but that was a while ago. I have since upgraded, though with the crappy games coming out I have to wonder why I bothered?].

Bottom line: with the exception of Portal 2 (which I purchased simply for the physics, puzzles and quirky commentary) I haven't bought a regular game that I simply felt I "had to have", anymore. I'm buying more Blu-rays, 3D at that, and other things that I feel I get more use out of to satisfy my inner geek. Modern games are leaving me feeling that I'm being deprived of the true potential out there. So I "buy" apps, which may not have the graphic interface of my Hi-Def TV but are at least new and cheap. Truthfully, though, since I am on the android platform, even games like Angry Birds can be downloaded FREE and I have yet to pay for an app that I couldn't live without or that some other app couldn't do in whole or in part.

When I think of modern gaming now, I cringe. I still like to play my old systems (Intellivision, Nintendo, Super NES, N64, Xbox, and such) but I do that for nostalgia here and there. I no longer devote whole days to console/PC games because they, too, feel more nostalgic than current anymore [ed. - with the exception of Portal 2, again. I put in 9 hours on the game and have beaten the single player version, though I've yet to try the Co-op mode].

Developers, please start innovating again. If Microsoft, Sony and Nintendo do not have the hardware to support your criteria for making a good game, then just make it for the Mac or PC! You're shooting yourselves by dumbing down your games just to get them on a gaming console. Trust me! If you make a game that pushes the envelope, raises the bar and that console manufacturer's CAN'T support on their console then they WILL come around once they see all the money that they are losing out on. Meanwhile, you (as a Developer) will get praise and glory from the gaming community and save your business! No one will say, "Yeah, it was a fun enough game but could've been better". You won't be stuck with a bad rep for making lame games. You'll be king of the (gaming) world!!!

Another thing,...app developers continue to release updates to their games (often FREE,...again, see Angry Birds) and support their growth. Major Developers tend to put their game out, *maybe* provide some DLC that you pay an arm and a leg for (really, $5 dollars for Horse Armor in Oblivion???), and then move on to other things. No wonder people get tired of your game! If you're already moving on, why should they stick around with it?

Seriously, though, if given a choice between playing an app on an iPhone or Android and playing a console game, then I would go for the console game if both were priced closer together. I really WANT to buy games for the PC/Console,...but you Dev's aren't making it easy for me!

/End Rant

 

[killerclick]

No one makes flight sims anymore. I don't care about your games, I lost flight sims now you'll lose whatever games you like and it'll be all Angry Birds from now on.

 

[saxplayingcompnerd]

Apple didnt do anything, they took Palm's idea and since it was apple people ate it up like candy and now everyone has a smartphone.

 

[molo9000]

I think the reason for the decline of console sales is simple.
People already have a big library of games for their consoles and don't want to buy the 20th generic first person shooter sequel for 60bucks that only offers 5hours of gameplay.

The number of AAA games that are actually worth 60bucks has gone down significantly in recent years and consumers are beginning to learn and are no longer convinced by marketing hype and paid off review writers. Too often they've seen tons of bugs, boring gameplay, bad voice acting and criminally short single player campaigns in games that were marketed like they would bring world peace and cure cancer.

Even Portal 2 is just 6-7hours long. *shakefist*

 

[happyballz]

Adjust, adjust, adjust... can't adjust then go out of business. Stop crying "king of engine licensing" when you can't even supply your paying customers with your engine as promised... as soon as company starts whining it just shows that they are running out of ideas or trying to force everyone to think "their way" because they fail to evolve.