high def DVD upconverts

G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Hi - I'm a bit new to all this but hopefully someone can help:

I have a HD tv that supports 1080i and only has component input. It does
not have any of those newer digital inputs like HDMI. I am in the market
for a new DVD player. My question is whether it is worth buying one of
those ones that say they can upconvert DVD pictures. Will I be able to
take advantage of this, or is my TV not compatible.

If not, then what DVD player should I buy for optimal audio and video
within a modest budget (something you can find at a local best
buy/circuit city). I have to figure that those $30 DVD players can't be
as good as the full fledged $100 counterparts, can they?
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Jeremy Dominik wrote:
> Hi - I'm a bit new to all this but hopefully someone can help:
>
> I have a HD tv that supports 1080i and only has component input. It
> does not have any of those newer digital inputs like HDMI. I am in
> the market for a new DVD player. My question is whether it is worth
> buying one of those ones that say they can upconvert DVD pictures.
> Will I be able to take advantage of this, or is my TV not compatible.

There are still a couple that upconvert over component, but make sure your
TV doesn't do it for you. There are extensive discussions on avsforums.com
about these.

>
> If not, then what DVD player should I buy for optimal audio and video
> within a modest budget (something you can find at a local best
> buy/circuit city). I have to figure that those $30 DVD players can't
> be as good as the full fledged $100 counterparts, can they?

I can't comment on these, but there is usually a good reason why some things
are that much cheaper.
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

thank you for your help: one follow-up question: Will the upconvert
still be noticeable even on a smaller tv (27 inches)?

L Alpert wrote:

> Jeremy Dominik wrote:
>
>>Hi - I'm a bit new to all this but hopefully someone can help:
>>
>>I have a HD tv that supports 1080i and only has component input. It
>>does not have any of those newer digital inputs like HDMI. I am in
>>the market for a new DVD player. My question is whether it is worth
>>buying one of those ones that say they can upconvert DVD pictures.
>>Will I be able to take advantage of this, or is my TV not compatible.
>
>
> There are still a couple that upconvert over component, but make sure your
> TV doesn't do it for you. There are extensive discussions on avsforums.com
> about these.
>
>
>>If not, then what DVD player should I buy for optimal audio and video
>>within a modest budget (something you can find at a local best
>>buy/circuit city). I have to figure that those $30 DVD players can't
>>be as good as the full fledged $100 counterparts, can they?
>
>
> I can't comment on these, but there is usually a good reason why some things
> are that much cheaper.
>
>
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

"Jeremy Dominik" <jdominik@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:UoLte.2639$ik5.2553@fe12.lga...
> Hi - I'm a bit new to all this but hopefully someone can help:
>
> I have a HD tv that supports 1080i and only has component input. It does
> not have any of those newer digital inputs like HDMI. I am in the market
> for a new DVD player. My question is whether it is worth buying one of
> those ones that say they can upconvert DVD pictures. Will I be able to
> take advantage of this, or is my TV not compatible.
>
> If not, then what DVD player should I buy for optimal audio and video
> within a modest budget (something you can find at a local best buy/circuit
> city). I have to figure that those $30 DVD players can't be as good as the
> full fledged $100 counterparts, can they?

As a minimum you must have a DVD that supports 480P. As to upconverting
from there, unless your TV has terrible video processing there is no
benefit in getting an upconverting DVD player.
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Jeremy Dominik <jdominik@optonline.net> wrote in news:UoLte.2639$ik5.2553
@fe12.lga:

> Hi - I'm a bit new to all this but hopefully someone can help:
>
> I have a HD tv that supports 1080i and only has component input. It
does
> not have any of those newer digital inputs like HDMI. I am in the
market
> for a new DVD player. My question is whether it is worth buying one of
> those ones that say they can upconvert DVD pictures. Will I be able to
> take advantage of this, or is my TV not compatible.
>
> If not, then what DVD player should I buy for optimal audio and video
> within a modest budget (something you can find at a local best
> buy/circuit city). I have to figure that those $30 DVD players can't be
> as good as the full fledged $100 counterparts, can they?

I bought a Samsung 5-disc player for $25 on eBay that does everything I
need it to do. My TV upconverts 480p anyway and can be sized for the
anamorphic widescreen stuff. Moreover the player will size and anamorph
the non-anamorphic letter-boxed stuff for me. I get excellent, seamless,
sharp pictures with no horizontal scan lines visible and good detail.
1080i from the satellite is a cut better, but until DVD technology puts
it on the market with lots of content, I'm going to stick with what I
have.


--
Dave Oldridge+
ICQ 1800667

A false witness is worse than no witness at all.
God is an evolutionist.
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Jeremy Dominik <jdominik@optonline.net> wrote in
news:42B7BB85.3050308@optonline.net:

> thank you for your help: one follow-up question: Will the upconvert
> still be noticeable even on a smaller tv (27 inches)?

I'll put my 27-inch HDTV up against any standard-def model and blow it
away!


--
Dave Oldridge+
ICQ 1800667

A false witness is worse than no witness at all.
God is an evolutionist.
 

guest

Distinguished
Jan 25, 2001
17
0
18,560
0
Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

--
www.unclet.netfirms.com
"Jeff Rigby" <jeffg212@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:CfCdnUm1lYP7kiXfRVn-sg@comcast.com...
>
> "Jeremy Dominik" <jdominik@optonline.net> wrote in message
> news:UoLte.2639$ik5.2553@fe12.lga...
>> Hi - I'm a bit new to all this but hopefully someone can help:
>>
>> I have a HD tv that supports 1080i and only has component input. It does
>> not have any of those newer digital inputs like HDMI. I am in the market
>> for a new DVD player. My question is whether it is worth buying one of
>> those ones that say they can upconvert DVD pictures. Will I be able to
>> take advantage of this, or is my TV not compatible.
>>
>> If not, then what DVD player should I buy for optimal audio and video
>> within a modest budget (something you can find at a local best
>> buy/circuit city). I have to figure that those $30 DVD players can't be
>> as good as the full fledged $100 counterparts, can they?
>
> As a minimum you must have a DVD that supports 480P. As to upconverting
> from there, unless your TV has terrible video processing there is no
> benefit in getting an upconverting DVD player.
>

Don't listen to him.
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

I do not notice a difference myself. I wouldn't go out of my way to get an
upscaling player or worry about it much.

--Dan

"Jeremy Dominik" <jdominik@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:UoLte.2639$ik5.2553@fe12.lga...
> Hi - I'm a bit new to all this but hopefully someone can help:
>
> I have a HD tv that supports 1080i and only has component input. It does
> not have any of those newer digital inputs like HDMI. I am in the market
> for a new DVD player. My question is whether it is worth buying one of
> those ones that say they can upconvert DVD pictures. Will I be able to
> take advantage of this, or is my TV not compatible.
>
> If not, then what DVD player should I buy for optimal audio and video
> within a modest budget (something you can find at a local best buy/circuit
> city). I have to figure that those $30 DVD players can't be as good as the
> full fledged $100 counterparts, can they?
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Jeremy Dominik <jdominik@optonline.net> wrote:

>Hi - I'm a bit new to all this but hopefully someone can help:
>
>I have a HD tv that supports 1080i and only has component input. It does
>not have any of those newer digital inputs like HDMI. I am in the market
>for a new DVD player. My question is whether it is worth buying one of
>those ones that say they can upconvert DVD pictures. Will I be able to
>take advantage of this, or is my TV not compatible.

You can't get any greater resolution out of a DVD with upconversion.
The biggest advantage is that if the TV has a digital display
(basically anything but CRT) and a digital input, an upconverter can
avoid a D/A conversion in the player and an A/D conversion in the TV.
But you don't have a digital input.

All digital displays must up- or down-convert to their native
resolution (at least 720 lines for HDTV) but a CRT might just scan at
the incoming resolution. If you can see scan lines on 480i material
(more so than on 720p or 1080i) then upconversion in the player could
help by making the scan lines less visible.

Features I'd look for:

- Component output. Most have this, but some of the cheapest ones
don't.

- Progressive scan. Nearly all players today offer this.

- Ability to make use of the anamorphic feature. I'd be surprised if
any player couldn't do that.

- Digital audio, if your audio system can handle it or there's any
chance you'll upgrade the audio system before you replace the DVD
player. And make sure it's compatible with your system; there are
several types.

>If not, then what DVD player should I buy for optimal audio and video
>within a modest budget (something you can find at a local best
>buy/circuit city). I have to figure that those $30 DVD players can't be
>as good as the full fledged $100 counterparts, can they?

One popular player with those features is the Philips DVP642. Its
popularity is due not so much to its quality (it's cheaply made) as to
its extra features. It will play several computer-related video
formats such as VCD, SVCD and DivX. Reportedly it will play some
XviDs and not others. Also does MP3 audio. And one or two
undocumented features you'll find out about if you research it on the
Web. About $70 lots of places, less if you shop around. Here are
links to a couple of reviews:

http://www.techtastic.ca/reviews3/dvp642.html
http://www.videohelp.com/dvdplayers.php?DVDnameid=4117&Search=Search&

Del Mibbler
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Del Mibbler (mibbler@nycap.rr.com) wrote in alt.tv.tech.hdtv:
> You can't get any greater resolution out of a DVD with upconversion.

You can get a better picture, though, through dithering. A line that is
nearly (but not exactly) horizontal or vertical can benefit from the extra
resolution by appearing more like a line and less like a series of steps.

--
Jeff Rife | "Tragedy struck today in Sector Nine as rebel
| terrorists blew up the Death Star, killing
| thousands. The Rebel Alliance, a fringe group
| of anti-Empire fanatics, has claimed
| responsibility for the terrorist act.
| Fortunately, Lord Vader escaped without harm.
| Our hearts go out to the families of the
| victims."
| -- "NewsRadio"
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Jeremy Dominik wrote:
> thank you for your help: one follow-up question: Will the upconvert
> still be noticeable even on a smaller tv (27 inches)?

Couldn't tell you that. Maybe you will get to give us your impression.


>
> L Alpert wrote:
>
>> Jeremy Dominick wrote:
>>
>>> Hi - I'm a bit new to all this but hopefully someone can help:
>>>
>>> I have a HD tv that supports 1080i and only has component input. It
>>> does not have any of those newer digital inputs like HDMI. I am in
>>> the market for a new DVD player. My question is whether it is worth
>>> buying one of those ones that say they can upconvert DVD pictures.
>>> Will I be able to take advantage of this, or is my TV not
>>> compatible.
>>
>>
>> There are still a couple that upconvert over component, but make
>> sure your TV doesn't do it for you. There are extensive discussions
>> on avsforums.com about these.
>>
>>
>>> If not, then what DVD player should I buy for optimal audio and
>>> video within a modest budget (something you can find at a local best
>>> buy/circuit city). I have to figure that those $30 DVD players can't
>>> be as good as the full fledged $100 counterparts, can they?
>>
>>
>> I can't comment on these, but there is usually a good reason why
>> some things are that much cheaper.
 

DaveR

Distinguished
Nov 6, 2003
43
0
18,580
0
Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

On Mon, 20 Jun 2005 18:07:45 -0400, Jeremy Dominik
<jdominik@optonline.net> wrote:

>I have a HD tv that supports 1080i and only has component input. It does
>not have any of those newer digital inputs like HDMI. I am in the market
>for a new DVD player. My question is whether it is worth buying one of
>those ones that say they can upconvert DVD pictures. Will I be able to
>take advantage of this, or is my TV not compatible.

Nearly all DVD players will not upconvert over component, due to the
paranoid movie industry's demands. There may be a few players left
that do, but they will be hard to find.

Therefore you will absolutely not benefit from an upconverting DVD
player. A good old progressive scan with 480p output is all you need.
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

DaveR wrote:
> On Mon, 20 Jun 2005 18:07:45 -0400, Jeremy Dominik
> <jdominik@optonline.net> wrote:
>
>> I have a HD tv that supports 1080i and only has component input. It
>> does not have any of those newer digital inputs like HDMI. I am in
>> the market for a new DVD player. My question is whether it is worth
>> buying one of those ones that say they can upconvert DVD pictures.
>> Will I be able to take advantage of this, or is my TV not compatible.
>
> Nearly all DVD players will not upconvert over component, due to the
> paranoid movie industry's demands. There may be a few players left
> that do, but they will be hard to find.

Bravo

HD
http://www.220-electronics.com/dvd/418.htm

NeoNeo
http://www.neuneo.com/body/product/HVD2081/feature.asp

There are a few others. Lots of discussion at avsforums on most of them.

>
> Therefore you will absolutely not benefit from an upconverting DVD
> player. A good old progressive scan with 480p output is all you need.
 

Baked

Distinguished
Apr 4, 2004
20
0
18,560
0
Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

On Tue, 21 Jun 2005 15:14:34 GMT, Dave Oldridge <doldridg@leavethisoutshaw.ca>
wrote:

>Moreover the player will size and anamorph
>the non-anamorphic letter-boxed stuff for me.

LOL!

Thanks for the laugh of the day.
 

guest

Distinguished
Jan 25, 2001
17
0
18,560
0
Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

--
www.unclet.netfirms.com
"DaveR" <NOSPAM_drubin@NOSPAM_i-2000.com> wrote in message
news:0Ya5QhDd8g85PEssabCBMwm5uTVy@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 20 Jun 2005 18:07:45 -0400, Jeremy Dominik
> <jdominik@optonline.net> wrote:
>
>>I have a HD tv that supports 1080i and only has component input. It does
>>not have any of those newer digital inputs like HDMI. I am in the market
>>for a new DVD player. My question is whether it is worth buying one of
>>those ones that say they can upconvert DVD pictures. Will I be able to
>>take advantage of this, or is my TV not compatible.
>
> Nearly all DVD players will not upconvert over component, due to the
> paranoid movie industry's demands. There may be a few players left
> that do, but they will be hard to find.
>
> Therefore you will absolutely not benefit from an upconverting DVD
> player. A good old progressive scan with 480p output is all you need.

There are great benefits my friend. If you can see a benefit from
progressive scanning, then why not up-converting? If there is no advantage
in up-converting, then why do you believe it when it comes to the TV's
up-converting chip? I am here to tell you that I see it very clearly and
would find it very hard to watch a DVD without it.

I started getting back in my James Bond films. I was watching "The Living
Daylights" and believe when I tell you, there is a big difference. It was
super clear and sharp. With the latest firmware update(Panny s97), it
almost matches broadcast HDTV! Note that I said 'almost' for you specific
nuts.

Don't ever listen to someone who probably never had one hooked up. Would
not buy it because they are too cheap. Are only going by the science that
they perceive. I mean, he is right in that you cannot get more resolution
out of resolution that was not there, but look at HDTV - same thing. It
is -up-converting most programs. I am sure that you see a difference right?

I buddy of mine just got involved. I was afraid that he would not see the
difference, but he saw it right away and was pleased. He has a Samsung
up-convert DVD and a 32" LCD screen(16:9). I have a 34" JVC CRT and I see
that the CRT has a lot better detail. This is one reason I stuck with a
CRT. The LCD has better on-screen graphics displays like wording and what
not. Of course I did not tell my buddy this as I did not want to ruin his
happiness. He also thinks that he has a better TV than mine because his is
flat panel. Never fail to bet on JVC!
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Baked <baked@nowhere.invalid> wrote in
news:78ebd$42ba0174$453de2c1$15643@FUSE.NET:

> On Tue, 21 Jun 2005 15:14:34 GMT, Dave Oldridge
> <doldridg@leavethisoutshaw.ca> wrote:
>
>>Moreover the player will size and anamorph
>>the non-anamorphic letter-boxed stuff for me.
>
> LOL!
>
> Thanks for the laugh of the day.

Glad you liked it.

Actually, there is quite a bit that can be done on the fly with good
MPEG-2 decoding firmware. It will not, of course, add any resolution to
what's on the DVD, but it can enable you to display it better. By taking
a letter-boxed image (e.g. the 16:9 image of the Buffy episode "Once More
with Feeling" -- the only episode so filmed) and sending it anamorphed to
4:3 (clipping the black letter-box bars) to my TV as an anamorphed 480p
signal, I can set the TV to 16:9 full screen to display the result full
screen. Without the feature I'd have to watch it letter-boxed with the
TV in 4:3 mode. Do you understand the difference?

--
Dave Oldridge+
ICQ 1800667

A false witness is worse than no witness at all.
God is an evolutionist.
 

bc4

Distinguished
Apr 20, 2004
134
0
18,630
0
Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

"Guest" <n0gar@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:8erue.1804$re.1797@newssvr19.news.prodigy.com...
>
>
> --
> www.unclet.netfirms.com
> "DaveR" <NOSPAM_drubin@NOSPAM_i-2000.com> wrote in message
> news:0Ya5QhDd8g85PEssabCBMwm5uTVy@4ax.com...
>> On Mon, 20 Jun 2005 18:07:45 -0400, Jeremy Dominik
>> <jdominik@optonline.net> wrote:
>>
>>>I have a HD tv that supports 1080i and only has component input. It does
>>>not have any of those newer digital inputs like HDMI. I am in the market
>>>for a new DVD player. My question is whether it is worth buying one of
>>>those ones that say they can upconvert DVD pictures. Will I be able to
>>>take advantage of this, or is my TV not compatible.
>>
>> Nearly all DVD players will not upconvert over component, due to the
>> paranoid movie industry's demands. There may be a few players left
>> that do, but they will be hard to find.
>>
>> Therefore you will absolutely not benefit from an upconverting DVD
>> player. A good old progressive scan with 480p output is all you need.
>
> There are great benefits my friend. If you can see a benefit from
> progressive scanning, then why not up-converting? If there is no
> advantage in up-converting, then why do you believe it when it comes to
> the TV's up-converting chip? I am here to tell you that I see it very
> clearly and would find it very hard to watch a DVD without it.
>
> I started getting back in my James Bond films. I was watching "The Living
> Daylights" and believe when I tell you, there is a big difference. It was
> super clear and sharp. With the latest firmware update(Panny s97), it
> almost matches broadcast HDTV! Note that I said 'almost' for you specific
> nuts.
>
> Don't ever listen to someone who probably never had one hooked up. Would
> not buy it because they are too cheap. Are only going by the science that
> they perceive. I mean, he is right in that you cannot get more resolution
> out of resolution that was not there, but look at HDTV - same thing. It
> is -up-converting most programs. I am sure that you see a difference
> right?
>
> I buddy of mine just got involved. I was afraid that he would not see the
> difference, but he saw it right away and was pleased. He has a Samsung
> up-convert DVD and a 32" LCD screen(16:9). I have a 34" JVC CRT and I see
> that the CRT has a lot better detail. This is one reason I stuck with a
> CRT. The LCD has better on-screen graphics displays like wording and what
> not. Of course I did not tell my buddy this as I did not want to ruin his
> happiness. He also thinks that he has a better TV than mine because his
> is flat panel. Never fail to bet on JVC!


I have a Samsung 32" LCD and use a LG3510a DVD player to upconvert via DVI
cable and YES the image is much better with the upscale to 720P. There is
something else to consider though. There is some copy protection built into
the cables. DVI and HDMI are HDCP or Hi Def Copy Protected. So I don't
know the full ramifications of this but it may just pertain to recording the
signal and not watching the signal. BUT I did notice that the $110 Monster
DVI cable was about half of the resolution of the $19 DVI cable that I
bought at Cablemasters. I took the Monster back. So I suppose that maybe
there are DVI cables that are HDCP and some that aren't.

BC




>
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Dave Oldridge <doldridg@leavethisoutshaw.ca> wrote (in part):

>By taking
>a letter-boxed image (e.g. the 16:9 image of the Buffy episode "Once More
>with Feeling" -- the only episode so filmed) and sending it anamorphed to
>4:3 (clipping the black letter-box bars) to my TV as an anamorphed 480p
>signal, I can set the TV to 16:9 full screen to display the result full
>screen.

Now, there's an episode I'd like to have in HD. Exceptional
television that never received the critical acclaim it deserved.

Guess I'll have to wait until the local stations start demanding their
syndicated shows in HD. Even then it'll probably be the shortened
version.

Del Mibbler
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

Del Mibbler <mibbler@nycap.rr.com> wrote in
news:8thlb1h6vmln1vurn7io8vce19lqn7uvrk@4ax.com:

> Dave Oldridge <doldridg@leavethisoutshaw.ca> wrote (in part):
>
>>By taking
>>a letter-boxed image (e.g. the 16:9 image of the Buffy episode "Once
>>More with Feeling" -- the only episode so filmed) and sending it
>>anamorphed to 4:3 (clipping the black letter-box bars) to my TV as an
>>anamorphed 480p signal, I can set the TV to 16:9 full screen to
>>display the result full screen.
>
> Now, there's an episode I'd like to have in HD. Exceptional
> television that never received the critical acclaim it deserved.
>
> Guess I'll have to wait until the local stations start demanding their
> syndicated shows in HD. Even then it'll probably be the shortened
> version.

Well, if there's a demand and there's an HD DVD spec soon enough, maybe
20th Century Fox will put it out in HD on a "best of Buffy" DVD pack or
something. If enough fans squawk loud enough that's sometimes enough to
get the ball rolling.

I'd not mind seeing the whole series re-done at 1080i resolution. The
first season was filmed on 16mm and might not look all that good, but the
rest was done on good 35mm stock and my TV actually does play 1080i at
4:3 full screen if that's what you give it.

--
Dave Oldridge+
ICQ 1800667

A false witness is worse than no witness at all.
God is an evolutionist.
 

Baked

Distinguished
Apr 4, 2004
20
0
18,560
0
Archived from groups: alt.tv.tech.hdtv (More info?)

On Thu, 23 Jun 2005 05:02:51 GMT, Dave Oldridge <doldridg@leavethisoutshaw.ca>
wrote:

>Do you understand the difference?

Do you understand that it is ZOOMED, not "anamorphed"?
 

ASK THE COMMUNITY