Providing ESN for an ebay phone

[rico]

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

I'm engaged in a dispute with an idiot - He claims that,when bidding on a
phone on ebay,one should never expect the seller to provide you with the
ESN,as there are things a scam artist can do with it.
I say BS,and I wouldn't bid on a phone if the seller refused to provide the
ESN before the auction closed.
So is there any good reason for a seller not to disclose a phones ESN ?

I've sold a few phones on ebay,and listed the ESN right in the auction.

 

[Eric]

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

(Rico) wrote:
<<I'm engaged in a dispute with an idiot - He claims that,when bidding
on a phone on ebay,one should never expect the seller to provide you
with the ESN,as there are things a scam artist can do with it. I say
BS,and I wouldn't bid on a phone if the seller refused to provide the
ESN before the auction closed.
So is there any good reason for a seller not to disclose a phones ESN ?
>>

Absolutely not. Unless the sellar has something to hide, it harms no
one or anything to give out the ESN upon request. Although one could
use the ESN to activate the phone without physically having it in one's
possession... it would be stupid to do so and he/she would have to add
an additional line on his/her account to do so, or pay a monthly charge
for a phone he/she doesn't even have. If someone wanted to report it
lost and be an ass about it, that could happen, but then Customer
Service would probably log who called in and reported it, so it would be
traced back if it was a prank.

<<I've sold a few phones on ebay,and listed the ESN right in the
auction. >>

That is the best, honest and most upfront way to do it.

Eric

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

Rico <BC@dt.com> wrote:
> I'm engaged in a dispute with an idiot - He claims that,when bidding on a
> phone on ebay,one should never expect the seller to provide you with the
> ESN,as there are things a scam artist can do with it.
> I say BS,and I wouldn't bid on a phone if the seller refused to provide the
> ESN before the auction closed.
> So is there any good reason for a seller not to disclose a phones ESN ?

> I've sold a few phones on ebay,and listed the ESN right in the auction.

I had exactly this situation: some of the eBay auctioneers selling the P300
we were looking for provided ESNs in their auction listings, but the guy we
bought from didn't for that reason (we bid on it anyhow because we decided to
trust him). I called Sprint. The only way I'm told you can activate a used
Sprint phone on your account is if the previous owner de-activated it, either
by terminating service with Sprint or by replacing the phone with a new one.

So your friend is wrong... UNLESS the phone is already de-activated (for
example, if he already bought a new one).

--
JustThe.net Internet & New Media Services, Apple Valley, CA PGP: 0xE3AE35ED
Steven J. Sobol, Geek In Charge / 888.480.4NET (4638) / sjsobol@JustThe.net
Domain Names, $9.95/yr, 24x7 service: http/DomainNames.JustThe.net/
"someone once called me a sofa, but i didn't feel compelled to rush out and buy
slip covers." -adam brower * Hiroshima '45, Chernobyl '86, Windows 98/2000/2003

 

[techgeek]

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

Rico <BC@dt.com> wrote in message news:<Xns94D688997A64Aewrfdgrstnetaakeanfk@140.99.99.130>...
> I'm engaged in a dispute with an idiot - He claims that,when bidding on a
> phone on ebay,one should never expect the seller to provide you with the
> ESN,as there are things a scam artist can do with it.
> I say BS,and I wouldn't bid on a phone if the seller refused to provide the
> ESN before the auction closed.
> So is there any good reason for a seller not to disclose a phones ESN ?
>
> I've sold a few phones on ebay,and listed the ESN right in the auction.

Hmm, posting the ESN in the auction itself may not be a good idea, but
any good and honest seller would supply you with the ESN upon request.

If I was bidding on a phone and the seller refused to give me the ESN,
then I'd be very suspicious.

But then again, if it's stolen, what's to stop them form supplying you
with a good esn and ship you the bad esn?

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

On Sun, 25 Apr 2004 17:25:54 GMT
Rico <BC@dt.com> wrote:

> I'm engaged in a dispute with an idiot - He claims that,when bidding on a
> phone on ebay,one should never expect the seller to provide you with the
> ESN,as there are things a scam artist can do with it.
> I say BS,and I wouldn't bid on a phone if the seller refused to provide the
> ESN before the auction closed.
> So is there any good reason for a seller not to disclose a phones ESN ?
>
> I've sold a few phones on ebay,and listed the ESN right in the auction.

im in this dilemma too, as im about to post a phone on ebay. what stops someone
from calling sprint and being like yah i just found a phone lying on the floor
here's teh ESN. would whoever gets the phone next be able to use it if it is
reported lost or wahtever?

 

[Mike]

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

Rico wrote:

> I'm engaged in a dispute with an idiot - He claims that,when bidding on a
> phone on ebay,one should never expect the seller to provide you with the
> ESN,as there are things a scam artist can do with it.
> I say BS,and I wouldn't bid on a phone if the seller refused to provide the
> ESN before the auction closed.
> So is there any good reason for a seller not to disclose a phones ESN ?
>
> I've sold a few phones on ebay,and listed the ESN right in the auction.

I'm about to sell a phone there, and this thought crossed my mind. Main
issue I see is that the person could put the phone on their account.
Most of the time during activations, if you just stay on the end of the
line and agree with everything, you'll finish the activation with no red
flags. If you've activated a handset before, I guarantee you can
complete the process without making a CSR ask uncomfortable questions.
Once it's there, they are in control, and could report the phone lost.
Sprint wouldn't reactivate the phone until the con artist took the phone
into a Sprint store with two forms of their id. That would probably
never happen, but that person could render the phone unusable. I would
suggest, as an alternative, using other means to prove the phone works.
If it's still active on the account, have them send a photo to you. Put
the photo on the display and take a picture of the phone. Have them call
the phone and then take a picture of the caller ID. Email that to the
buyer. If the phone isn't active, your options are more limited. Just
assume there are other fish in the sea, if you don't wish to give out
the ESN, don't.
-mike

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

I'm too naive to be a thief, so I don't get Mike's reasoning. For a con
artist to activate the phone using just its ESN, wouldn't the thief have
to initiate paying a monthly charge? And get no service for it because
he didn't actually have the phone? So he'd be spending money just to
prevent the auction winner from being able to use the phone? What's the
point?

Mike wrote:

> I'm about to sell a phone there, and this thought crossed my mind. Main
> issue I see is that the person could put the phone on their account.
> Most of the time during activations, if you just stay on the end of the
> line and agree with everything, you'll finish the activation with no red
> flags. If you've activated a handset before, I guarantee you can
> complete the process without making a CSR ask uncomfortable questions.
> Once it's there, they are in control, and could report the phone lost.
> Sprint wouldn't reactivate the phone until the con artist took the phone
> into a Sprint store with two forms of their id. That would probably
> never happen, but that person could render the phone unusable.
> <snip>

-mike
>

--
Frank Harris in San Francisco with an A620

 

[rico]

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

Mike <spamtrap@zbuffer.com> wrote in
news:7ISic.11757$e4.6661@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net:

> Rico wrote:
>
>> I'm engaged in a dispute with an idiot - He claims that,when bidding on
>> a phone on ebay,one should never expect the seller to provide you with
>> the ESN,as there are things a scam artist can do with it.
>> I say BS,and I wouldn't bid on a phone if the seller refused to provide
>> the ESN before the auction closed.
>> So is there any good reason for a seller not to disclose a phones ESN ?
>>
>> I've sold a few phones on ebay,and listed the ESN right in the auction.
>
> I'm about to sell a phone there, and this thought crossed my mind. Main
> issue I see is that the person could put the phone on their account.
> Most of the time during activations, if you just stay on the end of the
> line and agree with everything, you'll finish the activation with no red
> flags. If you've activated a handset before, I guarantee you can
> complete the process without making a CSR ask uncomfortable questions.
> Once it's there, they are in control, and could report the phone lost.
> Sprint wouldn't reactivate the phone until the con artist took the phone
> into a Sprint store with two forms of their id. That would probably
> never happen, but that person could render the phone unusable.

Then your talking more about a childish prankster than a scam artist.
Why would anyone want to render a phone of a person they don't even know
unusable ?
To get anywhere with a call to sprint,you have to at least give your name and
password.
If the potential prankster doesn't have that info,which they shouldn't,then
they wouldn't get very far.
I can't think of a single time when I called sprint and wasn't asked for a
password.
If thats your only concern,I'd say the odds against it happening are so
astronomical as to be safely dis-regarded.

> I would
> suggest, as an alternative, using other means to prove the phone works.
> If it's still active on the account, have them send a photo to you. Put
> the photo on the display and take a picture of the phone. Have them call
> the phone and then take a picture of the caller ID. Email that to the
> buyer. If the phone isn't active, your options are more limited. Just
> assume there are other fish in the sea, if you don't wish to give out
> the ESN, don't.
> -mike
>
Sounds good in theory - But not many people are going to want to jump through
hoops like that to place a bid - Not to mention most bids [unless your
selling/bidding on a very hot phone] occur with hours/minutes to go in the
auction,which would preclude doing what your saying.
Too,the vast majority of phones for auction on ebay,for obvious reasons,are
not currently active and capable of receiving calls.

Put the ESN in the auction.
Short of that,certainly send it to anyone inquiring about it.

 

[Mike]

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

Frank Harris wrote:

> I'm too naive to be a thief, so I don't get Mike's reasoning. For a con
> artist to activate the phone using just its ESN, wouldn't the thief have
> to initiate paying a monthly charge? And get no service for it because
> he didn't actually have the phone? So he'd be spending money just to
> prevent the auction winner from being able to use the phone? What's the
> point?
>

Not thievery, vandalism, really. Also, the person doing this may not
need to spend money. I've not been charged for an ESN swap. If I was
inclined, I could call, activate the phone and then call shortly
thereafter, say that I lost the phone, and activate my old handset.

-mike

 

[Eric]

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

spamtrap@zbuffer.com (Mike) wrote:
<<Not thievery, vandalism, really. Also, the person doing this may not
need to spend money. I've not been charged for an ESN swap. If I was
inclined, I could call, activate the phone and then call shortly
thereafter, say that I lost the phone, and activate my old handset. >>

That would be fully possible, but I would hope that it would raise some
red flags with whoever is doing the swapping at Customer Care if some
guy calls and activates a new phone, then calls in a few hours later and
said he lost it and to reactivate his old phone. That would be a lot of
trouble for someone to go through... all of which could probably be
traced back to him via the ESN. Wouldn't it be prudent for providers to
keep a log/database of who activates each individual ESN so malicious
things like this can be punishable/traced?

Eric

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

In article <Xns94D688997A64Aewrfdgrstnetaakeanfk@140.99.99.130>,
Rico <BC@dt.com> wrote:

> I'm engaged in a dispute with an idiot - He claims that,when bidding on a
> phone on ebay,one should never expect the seller to provide you with the
> ESN,as there are things a scam artist can do with it.
> I say BS,and I wouldn't bid on a phone if the seller refused to provide the
> ESN before the auction closed.
> So is there any good reason for a seller not to disclose a phones ESN ?
>
> I've sold a few phones on ebay,and listed the ESN right in the auction.

When I sold a phone on Ebay I didn't list the ESN or have anyone ask for
it. I did guarantee that the buyer could activate it.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

"Robert M." <rmarkoff@msn.com> wrote in message news:<rmarkoff-EBA4D8.17071825042004@news03.east.earthlink.net>...
> In article <Xns94D688997A64Aewrfdgrstnetaakeanfk@140.99.99.130>,
> Rico <BC@dt.com> wrote:
>
> > I'm engaged in a dispute with an idiot - He claims that,when bidding on a
> > phone on ebay,one should never expect the seller to provide you with the
> > ESN,as there are things a scam artist can do with it.
> > I say BS,and I wouldn't bid on a phone if the seller refused to provide the
> > ESN before the auction closed.
> > So is there any good reason for a seller not to disclose a phones ESN ?
> >
> > I've sold a few phones on ebay,and listed the ESN right in the auction.
>
> When I sold a phone on Ebay I didn't list the ESN or have anyone ask for
> it. I did guarantee that the buyer could activate it.


i have bought and sold numerous phones on ebay. Check for lots of
positive feedback--I have been ask questions and have responded to
questions, ask for and received esn's---If your seller is an idiot
now, he will be even more so if you have trouble with the phone.
Check that feedback.

 

[rico]

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

pcsguy@bellsouth.net (TechGeek) wrote in
news:7e761144.0404251448.729fe0f6@posting.google.com:

> Rico <BC@dt.com> wrote in message
> news:<Xns94D688997A64Aewrfdgrstnetaakeanfk@140.99.99.130>...
>> I'm engaged in a dispute with an idiot - He claims that,when bidding on
>> a phone on ebay,one should never expect the seller to provide you with
>> the ESN,as there are things a scam artist can do with it.
>> I say BS,and I wouldn't bid on a phone if the seller refused to provide
>> the ESN before the auction closed.
>> So is there any good reason for a seller not to disclose a phones ESN ?
>>
>> I've sold a few phones on ebay,and listed the ESN right in the auction.
>
> Hmm, posting the ESN in the auction itself may not be a good idea, but
> any good and honest seller would supply you with the ESN upon request.

Well then ... why wouldn't it be a good idea ?
Just a gut feeling ?

>
> If I was bidding on a phone and the seller refused to give me the ESN,
> then I'd be very suspicious.
>
> But then again, if it's stolen, what's to stop them form supplying you
> with a good esn and ship you the bad esn?
>

I agree,and mentioned that in another post in this thread.
Only thing there is if they did supply you with a bogus good ESN for a stolen
phone,you will have proof of their duplicity by simply saving the emails.
For that reason,most cons would either not answer that request at all,or
perhaps reply via an anonymous remailer - Either one of which should be
grounds for suspicion.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

Rico wrote:
> pcsguy@bellsouth.net (TechGeek) wrote in
> news:7e761144.0404251448.729fe0f6@posting.google.com:
>
>
>>Rico <BC@dt.com> wrote in message
>>news:<Xns94D688997A64Aewrfdgrstnetaakeanfk@140.99.99.130>...
>>
>>>I'm engaged in a dispute with an idiot - He claims that,when bidding on
>>>a phone on ebay,one should never expect the seller to provide you with
>>>the ESN,as there are things a scam artist can do with it.
>>>I say BS,and I wouldn't bid on a phone if the seller refused to provide
>>>the ESN before the auction closed.
>>>So is there any good reason for a seller not to disclose a phones ESN ?
>>>
>>>I've sold a few phones on ebay,and listed the ESN right in the auction.
>>
>>Hmm, posting the ESN in the auction itself may not be a good idea, but
>>any good and honest seller would supply you with the ESN upon request.
>
>
> Well then ... why wouldn't it be a good idea ?
> Just a gut feeling ?
>
>
>>If I was bidding on a phone and the seller refused to give me the ESN,
>>then I'd be very suspicious.
>>
>>But then again, if it's stolen, what's to stop them form supplying you
>>with a good esn and ship you the bad esn?
>>
>
>
> I agree,and mentioned that in another post in this thread.
> Only thing there is if they did supply you with a bogus good ESN for a stolen
> phone,you will have proof of their duplicity by simply saving the emails.
> For that reason,most cons would either not answer that request at all,or
> perhaps reply via an anonymous remailer - Either one of which should be
> grounds for suspicion.
>

Agreed, long and short of it, if he won't give the esn he's not worth
dealing with.
Good call !

 

[techgeek]

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

Rico <BC@dt.com> wrote in message news:<Xns94D6DC073A433ewrfdgrstnetaakeanfk@140.99.99.130>...
> >
> > Hmm, posting the ESN in the auction itself may not be a good idea, but
> > any good and honest seller would supply you with the ESN upon request.
>
> Well then ... why wouldn't it be a good idea ?
> Just a gut feeling ?
>
While the intentions are good, it leaves the ESN out for anyone to
mess with it (activate it, put it into fraud status) and screw you and
your buyer. I'd suggest leaving a line in there to say "feel free to
send me an email asking for the ESN" that way you're most likely to
get serious people looking at the ESN, since a lot of these people who
just want to cause trouble are rather lazy.


> >
> > If I was bidding on a phone and the seller refused to give me the ESN,
> > then I'd be very suspicious.
> >
> > But then again, if it's stolen, what's to stop them form supplying you
> > with a good esn and ship you the bad esn?
> >
>
> I agree,and mentioned that in another post in this thread.
> Only thing there is if they did supply you with a bogus good ESN for a stolen
> phone,you will have proof of their duplicity by simply saving the emails.
> For that reason,most cons would either not answer that request at all,or
> perhaps reply via an anonymous remailer - Either one of which should be
> grounds for suspicion.

True, but I have seen complaints about similar situations, my only
fallback would be if they do email you the ESN, or have it in the
auction, keep it, either print out the auction with a date stamp, or
save the email so you can verify it and then argue it later, that may
be your only chance of salvation in a situation like this.

 

[rico]

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

pcsguy@bellsouth.net (TechGeek) wrote in
news:7e761144.0404260525.3231fe3a@posting.google.com:

> Rico <BC@dt.com> wrote in message
> news:<Xns94D6DC073A433ewrfdgrstnetaakeanfk@140.99.99.130>...
>> >
>> > Hmm, posting the ESN in the auction itself may not be a good idea,
>> > but any good and honest seller would supply you with the ESN upon
>> > request.
>>
>> Well then ... why wouldn't it be a good idea ?
>> Just a gut feeling ?
>>
> While the intentions are good, it leaves the ESN out for anyone to
> mess with it (activate it, put it into fraud status) and screw you and
> your buyer. I'd suggest leaving a line in there to say "feel free to
> send me an email asking for the ESN" that way you're most likely to
> get serious people looking at the ESN, since a lot of these people who
> just want to cause trouble are rather lazy.

Not bad advice.
I definetly don't see any possible point in someone activating it - And the
risk is so small of someone risking their sprint account and ebay account for
fraud .. Just to be goofy ? - As to be negligible[?].
I'll say this - If I was a power seller selling phones on ebay for a living,
perhaps I'd do as you suggest.
For the casual seller,there is no point.

>
>
>> >
>> > If I was bidding on a phone and the seller refused to give me the
>> > ESN, then I'd be very suspicious.
>> >
>> > But then again, if it's stolen, what's to stop them form supplying
>> > you with a good esn and ship you the bad esn?
>> >
>>
>> I agree,and mentioned that in another post in this thread.
>> Only thing there is if they did supply you with a bogus good ESN for a
>> stolen phone,you will have proof of their duplicity by simply saving
>> the emails. For that reason,most cons would either not answer that
>> request at all,or perhaps reply via an anonymous remailer - Either one
>> of which should be grounds for suspicion.
>
> True, but I have seen complaints about similar situations, my only
> fallback would be if they do email you the ESN, or have it in the
> auction, keep it, either print out the auction with a date stamp, or
> save the email so you can verify it and then argue it later, that may
> be your only chance of salvation in a situation like this.
>
Yes its always a good idea to keep records such as this until transactions
are complete.
I keep all receipts,notices and relevant documents/pages in storage until I
get the item and am satified as a buyer,or receive + feedback as a seller.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

In article <Xns94D688997A64Aewrfdgrstnetaakeanfk@140.99.99.130>,
BC@dt.com says...
> I'm engaged in a dispute with an idiot - He claims that,when bidding on a
> phone on ebay,one should never expect the seller to provide you with the
> ESN,as there are things a scam artist can do with it.
> I say BS,and I wouldn't bid on a phone if the seller refused to provide the
> ESN before the auction closed.
> So is there any good reason for a seller not to disclose a phones ESN ?
>
> I've sold a few phones on ebay,and listed the ESN right in the auction.
>


Unfortunately, you're both right. A scammer *can* do things with the
ESN. Then again, I wouldn't buy without having the ESN, either.

I choose not to argue about it. If the seller won't provide, I won't
buy.

--
RØß
O/Siris
I work for Sprint PCS
I *don't* speak for them

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

In article <95d1cc5f4b0b62546cb2d51a5fc2e415@news.teranews.com>,
O/Siris <0siris@sprîntpcs.com> wrote:

> In article <Xns94D688997A64Aewrfdgrstnetaakeanfk@140.99.99.130>,
> BC@dt.com says...
> > I'm engaged in a dispute with an idiot - He claims that,when bidding on a
> > phone on ebay,one should never expect the seller to provide you with the
> > ESN,as there are things a scam artist can do with it.
> > I say BS,and I wouldn't bid on a phone if the seller refused to provide the
> > ESN before the auction closed.
> > So is there any good reason for a seller not to disclose a phones ESN ?
> >
> > I've sold a few phones on ebay,and listed the ESN right in the auction.
> >
>
>
> Unfortunately, you're both right. A scammer *can* do things with the
> ESN. Then again, I wouldn't buy without having the ESN, either.
>
> I choose not to argue about it. If the seller won't provide, I won't
> buy.

Is there any reason there could be a problem with a New still sealed in
the box phone?

 

[techgeek]

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

"Robert M." <rmarkoff@msn.com> wrote in message news:<rmarkoff-49D293.17182929042004@news04.east.earthlink.net>...
> In article <95d1cc5f4b0b62546cb2d51a5fc2e415@news.teranews.com>,
> O/Siris <0siris@sprîntpcs.com> wrote:
>
> > In article <Xns94D688997A64Aewrfdgrstnetaakeanfk@140.99.99.130>,
> > BC@dt.com says...
> > > I'm engaged in a dispute with an idiot - He claims that,when bidding on a
> > > phone on ebay,one should never expect the seller to provide you with the
> > > ESN,as there are things a scam artist can do with it.
> > > I say BS,and I wouldn't bid on a phone if the seller refused to provide the
> > > ESN before the auction closed.
> > > So is there any good reason for a seller not to disclose a phones ESN ?
> > >
> > > I've sold a few phones on ebay,and listed the ESN right in the auction.
> > >
> >
> >
> > Unfortunately, you're both right. A scammer *can* do things with the
> > ESN. Then again, I wouldn't buy without having the ESN, either.
> >
> > I choose not to argue about it. If the seller won't provide, I won't
> > buy.
>
> Is there any reason there could be a problem with a New still sealed in
> the box phone?

Yep, it could be stolen.

You steal a phone out of a store's inventory (or other means to get
unopened boxes, such as 3rd party, from UPS etc..), they know what
serial numbers are missing, they flag the ESNs as 'stolen'. The phone
can still be sealed, but can be a locked out ESN.

Besides, even if the seller says it's sealed, there's no proof until
you recieve it.

While there are honest sellers on EBay, there are a lot of dishonest
buyers. Check feedback thoroughly, look for consistancies in the
feedback, 20 people leaving identical positive feedback all with
ratings of 1 or 2 are suspicious to me.

Don't be afraid to ask questions, and pay close attention to the
replies and the ad on EBay.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

In article <rmarkoff-49D293.17182929042004
@news04.east.earthlink.net>, rmarkoff@msn.com says...
> Is there any reason there could be a problem with a New still sealed in
> the box phone?
>

Yeah. Sealing machines are not terribly expensive. Plus, the ESN is
on the box. A customer/scammer who is familiar with a real process
can fake a scam one.

--
RØß
O/Siris
I work for Sprint PCS
I *don't* speak for them