Damn, all this whining and the console is still vaporware at this point. We do not know what MS will do to make sure the console doesn't over heat this time around, but I am betting that the first thing they are going to address, because recall and repairs are expensive after the fact. As far as PC gamers complaining about out dated GPU...you do not have to buy a console. You should be happy that consoles are around, because they give video game makers an avenue to sell more content, so they can still make PC games to a smaller segment of the gaming community. Yes, I said smaller. So, enough with the bitching and just wait to see what happens with the next console war that is looming.
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captainspock
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- Mar 10, 2009
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When will they finally release Star wars battlefront 3 or, is this a lost cause, as I can not get it to run under windows 7. There was a rumor that it would only be released for console, and not pc
Live long and prosper.
Spock out
Live long and prosper.
Spock out
As long as it has DX11 i'm happy, it will allow the developers to make their titles very scalable by utilizing tessalation and the use of advanced shader programs, helping both the console itself as well as the PC gaming in one stroke. I hope this is the truth so the console wont be another dx9 or even dx10 crapbox!
I love my PC. It's eagerly awaiting BF3.
But seriously, except for the people like me who hang out on this site, most people don't want to be on some sort of an upgrade treadmill; they don't want to troubleshoot compatibility; they don't want to update drivers; they don't even want to install software. Many of the things that we see as positives are negatives for regular consumers.
Run your own server? Sure, I've got a couple older PCs running linux. I'll download the packages and set that up right now. For me that's entertaining. But I get, totally get, that I'm a minority and that the kind of automatic host server thing that a console does is far better for most consumers.
And graphics are simply overrated. DX11 vs DX10 vx DX9? The differences aren't terribly perceptible without a screen capture. Plus, one is ultimately playing on a television with a console--single monitor, 1080p. 4800 series graphics, such as the new Nintendo has, are more than sufficient. And the single monitor 1080p limitation is even a benefit in one sense--it levels the playing field. I've got an eyefinity setup on my PC with three monitor. My field of view is a huge advantage over what most people have. It's not fair and I know it.
What a next gen console needs is more ram, a CPU that can handle game AI better than the current generation, and more bandwidth for peripherals and controller options. I'd also love to see a console that had outputs for headphones on the controller (not voice chat but actual game sound) so that when two or more players are playing splitscreen they'd each have their own localized sound. I'm looking forward to the new Wii and the the new Xbox 720.
But seriously, except for the people like me who hang out on this site, most people don't want to be on some sort of an upgrade treadmill; they don't want to troubleshoot compatibility; they don't want to update drivers; they don't even want to install software. Many of the things that we see as positives are negatives for regular consumers.
Run your own server? Sure, I've got a couple older PCs running linux. I'll download the packages and set that up right now. For me that's entertaining. But I get, totally get, that I'm a minority and that the kind of automatic host server thing that a console does is far better for most consumers.
And graphics are simply overrated. DX11 vs DX10 vx DX9? The differences aren't terribly perceptible without a screen capture. Plus, one is ultimately playing on a television with a console--single monitor, 1080p. 4800 series graphics, such as the new Nintendo has, are more than sufficient. And the single monitor 1080p limitation is even a benefit in one sense--it levels the playing field. I've got an eyefinity setup on my PC with three monitor. My field of view is a huge advantage over what most people have. It's not fair and I know it.
What a next gen console needs is more ram, a CPU that can handle game AI better than the current generation, and more bandwidth for peripherals and controller options. I'd also love to see a console that had outputs for headphones on the controller (not voice chat but actual game sound) so that when two or more players are playing splitscreen they'd each have their own localized sound. I'm looking forward to the new Wii and the the new Xbox 720.
You forget though that a console could be half as powerful as a PC yet outperform it, because it is a closed platform, without all the other OS overheads or legacy support issues, or having to cater for different system configs. That allows developers to squeeze much more performance out of it than out of a PC.
Home TVs are locked in at 1080P, so gfx card performance only has to work at that level, which means the next consoles should kick arse at that resolution.
Don't think 1080P is enough? Bullshit. Show me a PC game at any resolution that looks as realistic as a Bluray Movie. Hell, show me a PC game that looks better than district 9 on DVD.
Resolution is a sham, better performance at 1080P will be enough, and might make the developers focus on better games rather than BS resolution and framerate 'advances'.
Home TVs are locked in at 1080P, so gfx card performance only has to work at that level, which means the next consoles should kick arse at that resolution.
Don't think 1080P is enough? Bullshit. Show me a PC game at any resolution that looks as realistic as a Bluray Movie. Hell, show me a PC game that looks better than district 9 on DVD.
Resolution is a sham, better performance at 1080P will be enough, and might make the developers focus on better games rather than BS resolution and framerate 'advances'.
Netherscourge
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- May 26, 2009
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"If these rumors are true then I guess the Kinect didn't really extend the 360's lifespan as planned."
Can I get a "wut"? The 360 launched in late 2005. The typical console lifespan is 5 years. The 360 will be turning 6 later this year, and will be at least 7 years old by the time a successor comes out (and that's assuming, the "720" is announced at E3 and released not long after). Two years added onto its lifespan doesn't constitute extending it... how exactly?
Can I get a "wut"? The 360 launched in late 2005. The typical console lifespan is 5 years. The 360 will be turning 6 later this year, and will be at least 7 years old by the time a successor comes out (and that's assuming, the "720" is announced at E3 and released not long after). Two years added onto its lifespan doesn't constitute extending it... how exactly?
wooodoggies
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- Feb 13, 2011
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talk about putting a hurt on the PC industry. DX11 console? sounds pretty good. Now, if i could just use a mouse and keyboard on it for gaming, i wouldnt need this hassley computer
captaincharisma
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- Oct 13, 2004
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[citation][nom]back_by_demand[/nom]You mean the ones that don't exist anymore since the last 2 previous generational updates?Is this still 2008 or something?Marty McFly is that you?[/citation]
LMAO yea they don't exist anymore because its hard pressed to find one that does not have a RROD and no matter how much they tried to improve it the crashbox still fails. the slim has already only been out a year barley so the verdict is still out on how long it takes for the slim to get the brand new red light of death LOL.
but that doesn't matter as long as they release a new halo and gears game for the new xbox it could have 100% FAIL rate and have xbox live cost 100 bucks a month and xbots will still buy it
LMAO yea they don't exist anymore because its hard pressed to find one that does not have a RROD and no matter how much they tried to improve it the crashbox still fails. the slim has already only been out a year barley so the verdict is still out on how long it takes for the slim to get the brand new red light of death LOL.
but that doesn't matter as long as they release a new halo and gears game for the new xbox it could have 100% FAIL rate and have xbox live cost 100 bucks a month and xbots will still buy it
captaincharisma
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[citation][nom]Phishy714[/nom]Unfortunately there is something that the consoles offer that PC's don't offer:Being able to have people over to play and hang out with. Yes, the PC, much like xbox live, has its own community and whatnot. Yes the PC is cheaper in the long run and more effecient and more powerful, but you can't really have your buddy(s) over and plug and play from the get go without the hassef bringing over all the hardware of another computer, much less setting it up and having space for it. PC's can't do that. At the same time, I can call a friend up, have them come over and play a few rounds of BC2 on my xbox and just have a good time.Convenience, more than raw power, is why consoles will never go away. p.s. I would LOVE to see a console (xbox or ps3) with upgradeable parts, much like a pc, except with all the compactability and convenience of a console. You want better graphics for your game? sure! go out and buy a "graphics card" for your particular console (tiered in terms of performance and price much like all PC parts are now) and enjoy better graphics. Part of the joy that PC's bring is the fact that you are able to customize it the way you want it, it becomes your baby that you grow and nuorish the way you want. Bring this concept to a console, being able to customize the graphics capabilities, cpu, ram, ect and you got yourself a winning combination.[/citation]
yea right. xbots already showed they rater pay 50 bucks a year to play games over the internet with people rather than invite people over
yea right. xbots already showed they rater pay 50 bucks a year to play games over the internet with people rather than invite people over
Consoles RIP? I've heard the same thing for the past 10 years. Keep on dreaming, PC nutters. The market has clearly spoken on the issue; consoles are here to stay, like it or not,
[citation][nom]cyrusthegreat[/nom]"I'm just happy game developers will be able to push the envelope on graphics a little further."You're kidding, right? The article states that crytek is using DX11 as the basis for next-gen development. So by the time xbox 720 hits stores in say 2014, it will showcase the cutting edge of graphics from 2010... thank you console gamers...[/citation]
Too bad Crybabytek doesn't utilize DX11 in it's pc games.
Too bad Crybabytek doesn't utilize DX11 in it's pc games.
[citation][nom]tulx[/nom]That's not how a console works. Noone will buy it if it costs $800. A console is basically a upper mid-range PC when it's launched and costs like a lower mid-range PC because it's manufactured inmillions and thus cheaper to make.I'm very glad MS is making the next console (no idea what the Wii U is...seems like a current gen console 5 years late), the current generation has held back the industry long enough. Modern high-end PCs are about 20 times faster than todays consoles, yet the games made for them are the same...[/citation]
Well, with announcement in 2012, the console will arrive in 2013-ish, probably before Christmas, so yes, DX12 mid range machine is exactly what you are talking about.
Well, with announcement in 2012, the console will arrive in 2013-ish, probably before Christmas, so yes, DX12 mid range machine is exactly what you are talking about.
Most people blame the console for holding back the games, which is not entirely true.
Consoles have brought in a lot of revenues from non-enthusiast gamers. That allows game studio to invest more in the games (some games cost over $100 million to develop) that would not have been possible otherwise.
Besides, even for PC games, most people (non-enthusiasts) do not upgrade their every three years. That said, I am not saying consoles aren't holding back graphic development a bit in the last few years of their life-cycle, but that's just the way things are. In the beginning years of their life cycle, they help push the limit too. So, stop complaining.
Consoles have brought in a lot of revenues from non-enthusiast gamers. That allows game studio to invest more in the games (some games cost over $100 million to develop) that would not have been possible otherwise.
Besides, even for PC games, most people (non-enthusiasts) do not upgrade their every three years. That said, I am not saying consoles aren't holding back graphic development a bit in the last few years of their life-cycle, but that's just the way things are. In the beginning years of their life cycle, they help push the limit too. So, stop complaining.
upgrade_1977
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- May 5, 2011
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I might be the only guy with a working xbox 360 manufactured in 2006 hehe... I did have to replace the optical drive as the eject button never worked. I had to slap the unit pretty good to get results.
Computer monitors are so great these days with hdmi, dvi, and vga inputs. There's no reason any pc gamer, like myself, can't have a console hooked up to the same monitor to enjoy both, depending on your mood.
The new xbox will support directx11 to create a (fake and unnecessary) reason to upgrade to Windows 8 because it will have directx12. History has shown us that all games for console and pc alike will continue to use dx9 probably even after directx11 consoles hit... atleast for awhile.
I can't see game graphics and content improving much beyond what we have today. We'll hopefully see 1080p output with anti-aliasing support. The problem is the amount of time and money it takes to produce a game like the ones we have today. I cant see developers investing (and gambling) more time and more money to develop a game that'll still need to hit that sweet spot pricing of around $60 msrp. I suspect since streaming services like onlive may or may not gain traction, we might see developers releasing game "installments". The initial release being a partial game available for download (partial in part to address download time and bandwidth caps). You would then see monthly chapters released to add to the game. I'm sure developers want to get a product to its customers from start to finish in a year or less, and they may move to chapter releases to accomplish this.
Ultimately, we'll see a large brick wall that stalls further graphical and gameplay improvements, not because of the hardware, but because of the time and money and labor and overhead it costs to produce. Remember, they're spending a lot of money to make a game and don't see any returns on that investment til its finished and being purchased.
Computer monitors are so great these days with hdmi, dvi, and vga inputs. There's no reason any pc gamer, like myself, can't have a console hooked up to the same monitor to enjoy both, depending on your mood.
The new xbox will support directx11 to create a (fake and unnecessary) reason to upgrade to Windows 8 because it will have directx12. History has shown us that all games for console and pc alike will continue to use dx9 probably even after directx11 consoles hit... atleast for awhile.
I can't see game graphics and content improving much beyond what we have today. We'll hopefully see 1080p output with anti-aliasing support. The problem is the amount of time and money it takes to produce a game like the ones we have today. I cant see developers investing (and gambling) more time and more money to develop a game that'll still need to hit that sweet spot pricing of around $60 msrp. I suspect since streaming services like onlive may or may not gain traction, we might see developers releasing game "installments". The initial release being a partial game available for download (partial in part to address download time and bandwidth caps). You would then see monthly chapters released to add to the game. I'm sure developers want to get a product to its customers from start to finish in a year or less, and they may move to chapter releases to accomplish this.
Ultimately, we'll see a large brick wall that stalls further graphical and gameplay improvements, not because of the hardware, but because of the time and money and labor and overhead it costs to produce. Remember, they're spending a lot of money to make a game and don't see any returns on that investment til its finished and being purchased.
upgrade_1977
Distinguished
- May 5, 2011
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[citation][nom]Phishy714[/nom]Unfortunately there is something that the consoles offer that PC's don't offer:Being able to have people over to play and hang out with. Yes, the PC, much like xbox live, has its own community and whatnot. Yes the PC is cheaper in the long run and more effecient and more powerful, but you can't really have your buddy(s) over and plug and play from the get go without the hassef bringing over all the hardware of another computer, much less setting it up and having space for it. PC's can't do that. At the same time, I can call a friend up, have them come over and play a few rounds of BC2 on my xbox and just have a good time.Convenience, more than raw power, is why consoles will never go away. p.s. I would LOVE to see a console (xbox or ps3) with upgradeable parts, much like a pc, except with all the compactability and convenience of a console. You want better graphics for your game? sure! go out and buy a "graphics card" for your particular console (tiered in terms of performance and price much like all PC parts are now) and enjoy better graphics. Part of the joy that PC's bring is the fact that you are able to customize it the way you want it, it becomes your baby that you grow and nuorish the way you want. Bring this concept to a console, being able to customize the graphics capabilities, cpu, ram, ect and you got yourself a winning combination.[/citation]
Um... Actually you can... I do it all the time with my pc. All I need is the power cord, xbox 360 controllers with the wireless reciever, and an hdmi cable.. And.......Thats right, an HD T.V. Just as simple as with xbox360 or ps3. Oh, but I don't have to bring my game cd's, because I just need to go through steam to play my games. 😀
Also, Community is better on PC, hardly any swearing or hating on each other like every console game i've ever played on the internet, and normally, you can have twice as many people play same game. Ex. GTA IV on console max 16 players, On PC, Max 32.. Plus I can use a decent headset with my surround sound all at the same time if I want. You ever try playing with the 360 headsets? What a terrible experience.
Much better gaming when you have your own screen though, hate playing xbox 360 with my friends, split screen sucks.
Oh, I just found a cool article comparing Crysis 2 on PC, PS3, and Xbox 360.. Interesting read.
http://imagequalitymatters.blogspot.com/2011/03/tech-analysis-crysis-2-360-vs-ps3-vs-pc.html
Quoted from the article: "Either way, there's still no question that Crysis 2 is a remarkably stunning release on the PC, and what it lacks in pure graphical advantage, it more than makes up for with vastly superior performance. Running the game at 720p, v-synced, and at the console target of 30fps should be no problem for most decent, older PC's, while people with mid-range and cutting edge hardware will easily be able to blow away both console versions entirely. "
Um... Actually you can... I do it all the time with my pc. All I need is the power cord, xbox 360 controllers with the wireless reciever, and an hdmi cable.. And.......Thats right, an HD T.V. Just as simple as with xbox360 or ps3. Oh, but I don't have to bring my game cd's, because I just need to go through steam to play my games. 😀
Also, Community is better on PC, hardly any swearing or hating on each other like every console game i've ever played on the internet, and normally, you can have twice as many people play same game. Ex. GTA IV on console max 16 players, On PC, Max 32.. Plus I can use a decent headset with my surround sound all at the same time if I want. You ever try playing with the 360 headsets? What a terrible experience.
Much better gaming when you have your own screen though, hate playing xbox 360 with my friends, split screen sucks.
Oh, I just found a cool article comparing Crysis 2 on PC, PS3, and Xbox 360.. Interesting read.
http://imagequalitymatters.blogspot.com/2011/03/tech-analysis-crysis-2-360-vs-ps3-vs-pc.html
Quoted from the article: "Either way, there's still no question that Crysis 2 is a remarkably stunning release on the PC, and what it lacks in pure graphical advantage, it more than makes up for with vastly superior performance. Running the game at 720p, v-synced, and at the console target of 30fps should be no problem for most decent, older PC's, while people with mid-range and cutting edge hardware will easily be able to blow away both console versions entirely. "
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