This is going to be a double whammy for my small business... I purchase product online because there is NO tax... then I have to add tax when I resell to my customers... With this bill, if there's no provisions addressing the double taxed customer, the cost of products are going to be way higher than what they are right now. All the more reason to abolish the current national and state tax system and put into place a flat tax rate for everyone, then distribute those taxes equally among the states and federal government.
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shin0bi272
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Anyone read atlas shrugged? When some new amazing thing comes out that changes the entire game the old companies that dont wanna change their business model etc. cry foul and run to washington to get them to ban or limit the new tech. Cause its not fair that they dont have this new tech or that they are entitled to the same chances that the people who have this new tech have even when they dont have it or cant use it themselves. So they will whine that something must be done to prevent others from using the new tech or keep them from leaving the state they live in to get to use the new tech or limit their use of the new tech.
And Maxor127... 1) its not the governments job to help people its their job to keep us safe from invasion and insurrection... go read article 1 section 8 of the constitution... its a laundry list of the powers of congress... should take you about 30 seconds to read it.
2) the wealthy already pay the vast vast majority of the taxes. The top 1% pay 40% of the taxes... the top 25% pay 97.5% of all the taxes. That includes corporations.
3) corporations DO pay taxes they just pass the cost on to you in the form of higher prices. Except maybe GM since they are owned by the government and maybe GE since they gave millions to obama in 08.
And Maxor127... 1) its not the governments job to help people its their job to keep us safe from invasion and insurrection... go read article 1 section 8 of the constitution... its a laundry list of the powers of congress... should take you about 30 seconds to read it.
2) the wealthy already pay the vast vast majority of the taxes. The top 1% pay 40% of the taxes... the top 25% pay 97.5% of all the taxes. That includes corporations.
3) corporations DO pay taxes they just pass the cost on to you in the form of higher prices. Except maybe GM since they are owned by the government and maybe GE since they gave millions to obama in 08.
[citation][nom]zak_mckraken[/nom]I agree with this. Online stores have an unfair advantage over bricks and mortar stores. I'm ont an overzealous "buy local" guy, but we do have to keep a healthy competition.[/citation]
an online store is cheaper because they don't need employees to work floor, keep the store clean, and restock shelves. even if there is sales tax online, online can still under cut local stores more than wal-mart could ever dream of.
that said, i live in wisconsin, we recently had a protest in the capital over unions. the people put tape on the walls, with protest posters. my goverment assessed that because of the tape, they caused over 20million in damages, and some of the more realistic numbers they came up with was 3 million... for tape on a wall...
if government stopped p!$$ing the tax money away, THIS WOULDN'T BE AN ISSUE.
i can say this, and i am probably right, but you could probably cut the national spending by 1 trillion if you looked in to alternatives to some of the more expensive crap.
an online store is cheaper because they don't need employees to work floor, keep the store clean, and restock shelves. even if there is sales tax online, online can still under cut local stores more than wal-mart could ever dream of.
that said, i live in wisconsin, we recently had a protest in the capital over unions. the people put tape on the walls, with protest posters. my goverment assessed that because of the tape, they caused over 20million in damages, and some of the more realistic numbers they came up with was 3 million... for tape on a wall...
if government stopped p!$$ing the tax money away, THIS WOULDN'T BE AN ISSUE.
i can say this, and i am probably right, but you could probably cut the national spending by 1 trillion if you looked in to alternatives to some of the more expensive crap.
shin0bi272
Distinguished
- Nov 20, 2007
- 271
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- 18,930
[citation][nom]jprobes[/nom]Wrong, Cutting sales tax and firing 20% of the non military workforce will do nothing but make more people in need of aid from the government and put a huge dent in it's tax revenue.[/citation]
the average income of a federal employee is now almost twice the average income of a private sector employee when you add all the benefits they get... so since the avg private sector employee makes ~50k/yr I'd say youre wrong here.
[citation]The idea that the "rich" provide us with jobs is the biggest lie the American populace has been fed for 30 years. The rich don't create jobs with tax cuts or subsidies, they pocket the money and put it to work in wall street where they only get taxed 15% on capital gains.[/citation]
When's the last time you got a job from someone making less than 30k/yr? Youre completely wrong with this statement... have you been reading karl marx or saul alinsky lately?
[citation]That is the biggest problem America has, is revenue. For 30 years the tax code has been slashed and raped by corporations/lobbyist who have made sure that the rich get to keep most of what they make and the poor people foot the bill.Most people chose not to accept this as reality because they have outlandish dreams of being filthy rich and this policy effecting them. That is why taxation is such a taboo subject now in American politics. The rich use the dreams of the poor to fuel their own gains while the masses, oblivious to being used, accept what they are told in one day hoping by choosing to support the rich it wont effect them when they become rich.[/citation]
If you do a LIIIITTLE bit of research you'll see that the top 1% pay 40% of the taxes and the top 25% pay 97.5% of the taxes... the bottom 48% pay NOTHING in taxes...
[citation]WRONG, you will never be rich. Not because the "government is out to keep you down" but that unless you invent something are a talented entertainer, it will never happen.When was the last time you heard of a Mechanical Engineer or an Architect becoming an Millionaire? Shit doesn't happen yo.[/citation]
tell that to jeff bezos and michael dell... they started amazon.com and dell computers in their garage and college dorm respectively. You can become a millionaire if you have that aim and take the proper measured risks and have the courage to keep trying even when you fail... cause you will... over and over and over. Are you watching a lot of michael moore movies?
[citation]And if you really want to know why jobs have been going overseas for the past 15 years. You can blame Wall Street and their insistence in the form of investment that companies generate larger % of profits year after year.The only way for companies to due that is to increase production without increasing costs, or ship jobs overseas so they don't have to pay the going rate for wages in the US.Why is it that production is at the same levels it was pre-recession, yet unemployment and wages are the same? Why are you mad at the government employees getting pensions and benefits? Shouldn't you be upset that you don't get these in the private sector?At a time where local and state governments are crippled due to massive revenue shortfalls generated from high unemployment, this is probably the best idea next to direct increases on income or property taxes depending on where you live. It mainly will benefit children and the elderly as that is mostly what the government spends its money on, aside from the military.[/citation]
Ok where to start here... umm...corporate tax and capital gains taxes here in america are the second highest in the world... only behind japan... whos been in a recession for 20 years. The higher the cost to run a business the more apt a business is to ship those jobs to places that are cheaper to operate... why? So you dont have to pay 99.99 for a pair of underwear and 100,000 for the CHEAPEST car on the market. Its called competition and it drives prices down as long as the competitors arent allowed to collude (that means work together to raise prices). Im sorry if that's too hard for you to understand but its plain supply and demand... if you and your competition offer the same item and you can offer it cheaper you will get the sale more often than not... We are mad at government employees because they are rioting and protesting over being asked to take a pay freeze for 1 year or a cut amounting to 8% and they literally break into the wisconsin capitol building to protest. They make their pay from our taxes (that you seem to be so intent on raising) and refuse to contract when the economy contracts. We lose our jobs and they get raises? I dont hardly think so! What government and union members have to understand is that we cant always afford exorbitant salaries and benefits but just like the liberals in congress when you mention the word cut... they start crying. Yeah Id love to get a raise when the economy contracts but I live in the real world where a business cant run a debt forever without going under.
[citation]Suck it up and pay the state sales tax on internet purchases along with the shipping. Nothing is free in this world, so quite fucking expecting it.End the American Empire. End the 2 wars, Raise Capital gains to 35% and create a 50% Millionaire tax bracket, End the death tax. (99.9% of Americans will never be effected by this so why should you give a fuck?).[/citation]
so wait tax the internet cause nothing is free... but eliminate the death tax? You care to make up your mind? The capital gains are already 35% as of jan 2011, and anyone who makes over 60,000 pays almost 50% in taxes before the tax credits for having kids and buying an eco box etc. when you include federal and state and local taxes. While the federal taxes are only 25-35% add another 15-25% for state taxes and even more for local taxes (like in cauleefornea cities). But the real issue here is why you think the government deserves ANY of my money for ANYTHING other than the military and the salaries of congress and the president. For social welfare? Social justice? Why is it only justice if someone else is capable of work but isnt working and Im working 2 jobs to get ahead but Im not giving these lazy people enough? I work with 3 or 4 people at one of my jobs who willingly lie to the government so they can get more in welfare and foodstamps and section 8 housing so that they can drive multiple cars with fly ass rims on all of them. So they are working (one of them is working 2 jobs!) and they are getting assistance from my taxes!
[citation]Reduce the income gap between the top 1% and the rest of us and put an end to the gross privatization of the government and the services they should be providing. (prisons, schools, energy and the Internet.)Then maybe we can have our tax free internet purchases.[/citation]
So redistribute the wealth huh? how did that work for the soviet union? or china or vietnam or north korea or cuba? Here's a hint ... all of them are having to allow private businesses now because a centrally planned government doesnt work. It cant provide for all the peoples best interests and well being. Im sorry if this bursts your bubble but like you said .. theres no such thing as a free lunch so suck it up.
the average income of a federal employee is now almost twice the average income of a private sector employee when you add all the benefits they get... so since the avg private sector employee makes ~50k/yr I'd say youre wrong here.
[citation]The idea that the "rich" provide us with jobs is the biggest lie the American populace has been fed for 30 years. The rich don't create jobs with tax cuts or subsidies, they pocket the money and put it to work in wall street where they only get taxed 15% on capital gains.[/citation]
When's the last time you got a job from someone making less than 30k/yr? Youre completely wrong with this statement... have you been reading karl marx or saul alinsky lately?
[citation]That is the biggest problem America has, is revenue. For 30 years the tax code has been slashed and raped by corporations/lobbyist who have made sure that the rich get to keep most of what they make and the poor people foot the bill.Most people chose not to accept this as reality because they have outlandish dreams of being filthy rich and this policy effecting them. That is why taxation is such a taboo subject now in American politics. The rich use the dreams of the poor to fuel their own gains while the masses, oblivious to being used, accept what they are told in one day hoping by choosing to support the rich it wont effect them when they become rich.[/citation]
If you do a LIIIITTLE bit of research you'll see that the top 1% pay 40% of the taxes and the top 25% pay 97.5% of the taxes... the bottom 48% pay NOTHING in taxes...
[citation]WRONG, you will never be rich. Not because the "government is out to keep you down" but that unless you invent something are a talented entertainer, it will never happen.When was the last time you heard of a Mechanical Engineer or an Architect becoming an Millionaire? Shit doesn't happen yo.[/citation]
tell that to jeff bezos and michael dell... they started amazon.com and dell computers in their garage and college dorm respectively. You can become a millionaire if you have that aim and take the proper measured risks and have the courage to keep trying even when you fail... cause you will... over and over and over. Are you watching a lot of michael moore movies?
[citation]And if you really want to know why jobs have been going overseas for the past 15 years. You can blame Wall Street and their insistence in the form of investment that companies generate larger % of profits year after year.The only way for companies to due that is to increase production without increasing costs, or ship jobs overseas so they don't have to pay the going rate for wages in the US.Why is it that production is at the same levels it was pre-recession, yet unemployment and wages are the same? Why are you mad at the government employees getting pensions and benefits? Shouldn't you be upset that you don't get these in the private sector?At a time where local and state governments are crippled due to massive revenue shortfalls generated from high unemployment, this is probably the best idea next to direct increases on income or property taxes depending on where you live. It mainly will benefit children and the elderly as that is mostly what the government spends its money on, aside from the military.[/citation]
Ok where to start here... umm...corporate tax and capital gains taxes here in america are the second highest in the world... only behind japan... whos been in a recession for 20 years. The higher the cost to run a business the more apt a business is to ship those jobs to places that are cheaper to operate... why? So you dont have to pay 99.99 for a pair of underwear and 100,000 for the CHEAPEST car on the market. Its called competition and it drives prices down as long as the competitors arent allowed to collude (that means work together to raise prices). Im sorry if that's too hard for you to understand but its plain supply and demand... if you and your competition offer the same item and you can offer it cheaper you will get the sale more often than not... We are mad at government employees because they are rioting and protesting over being asked to take a pay freeze for 1 year or a cut amounting to 8% and they literally break into the wisconsin capitol building to protest. They make their pay from our taxes (that you seem to be so intent on raising) and refuse to contract when the economy contracts. We lose our jobs and they get raises? I dont hardly think so! What government and union members have to understand is that we cant always afford exorbitant salaries and benefits but just like the liberals in congress when you mention the word cut... they start crying. Yeah Id love to get a raise when the economy contracts but I live in the real world where a business cant run a debt forever without going under.
[citation]Suck it up and pay the state sales tax on internet purchases along with the shipping. Nothing is free in this world, so quite fucking expecting it.End the American Empire. End the 2 wars, Raise Capital gains to 35% and create a 50% Millionaire tax bracket, End the death tax. (99.9% of Americans will never be effected by this so why should you give a fuck?).[/citation]
so wait tax the internet cause nothing is free... but eliminate the death tax? You care to make up your mind? The capital gains are already 35% as of jan 2011, and anyone who makes over 60,000 pays almost 50% in taxes before the tax credits for having kids and buying an eco box etc. when you include federal and state and local taxes. While the federal taxes are only 25-35% add another 15-25% for state taxes and even more for local taxes (like in cauleefornea cities). But the real issue here is why you think the government deserves ANY of my money for ANYTHING other than the military and the salaries of congress and the president. For social welfare? Social justice? Why is it only justice if someone else is capable of work but isnt working and Im working 2 jobs to get ahead but Im not giving these lazy people enough? I work with 3 or 4 people at one of my jobs who willingly lie to the government so they can get more in welfare and foodstamps and section 8 housing so that they can drive multiple cars with fly ass rims on all of them. So they are working (one of them is working 2 jobs!) and they are getting assistance from my taxes!
[citation]Reduce the income gap between the top 1% and the rest of us and put an end to the gross privatization of the government and the services they should be providing. (prisons, schools, energy and the Internet.)Then maybe we can have our tax free internet purchases.[/citation]
So redistribute the wealth huh? how did that work for the soviet union? or china or vietnam or north korea or cuba? Here's a hint ... all of them are having to allow private businesses now because a centrally planned government doesnt work. It cant provide for all the peoples best interests and well being. Im sorry if this bursts your bubble but like you said .. theres no such thing as a free lunch so suck it up.
[citation][nom]lasaldude[/nom]Shut the fuck!! G.E., the largest corporation in America made 14 billion last year and paid how much in taxes to the U.S. ZZZZEEEERRROOOOOO! That's right, Zero Fucking Dollars, They actually got a Refund of 4 Billion Dollars. Yeah they help in Green Energy and deserve some breaks but pay your share people. I want to move, I'm sick to my stomach!http
/www.nytimes.com/2011/03/25/ [...] .html?_r=1[/citation]
GE is the 4th largest corporation in the USA, you have wally world, exxonmobile and chevron ahead of GE
/www.nytimes.com/2011/03/25/ [...] .html?_r=1[/citation]GE is the 4th largest corporation in the USA, you have wally world, exxonmobile and chevron ahead of GE
[citation][nom]alidan[/nom]an online store is cheaper because they don't need employees to work floor, keep the store clean, and restock shelves. even if there is sales tax online, online can still under cut local stores more than wal-mart could ever dream of. that said, i live in wisconsin, we recently had a protest in the capital over unions. the people put tape on the walls, with protest posters. my goverment assessed that because of the tape, they caused over 20million in damages, and some of the more realistic numbers they came up with was 3 million... for tape on a wall...if government stopped p!$$ing the tax money away, THIS WOULDN'T BE AN ISSUE. i can say this, and i am probably right, but you could probably cut the national spending by 1 trillion if you looked in to alternatives to some of the more expensive crap.[/citation]
you are probably right? you must have no idea what the US budget looks like. In FY2010 (ending sept 30 2010) we spent 2.009 trillion dollars on mandatory spending (i.e. we are required by law to pay), such as social security ($695 Billion), medicare ($453 Billion), medicaid ($290 Billion), interest on the debt ($164 Billion), among others. we spent 1.368 trillion dollars on the "discretionary spending" about half of that, $663.7 billion, is the DoD. we took in 2.381 Trillion dollars in revenue (federal taxes and the such). So what is the "expensive crap" we shouldn't buy any more? There are a lot of things that are overspent in the government, but congress just had a fit trying to cut $61 billion.
so you would like to cut more than 75% of the discretionary spending budget? okay we will ENTIRELY cut the following:
DoD ($663.7 billion)- gone
Department of health and human services ($78.7 billion)-gone
Department of transportation ($72.5 billion)-gone
Department of Veterans Affairs ($52.5 billion)-gone
Department of State ($51.7 billion)-gone
Department of Housing and Urban development ($47.5 billion)-gone
Department of Education ($46.7 billion)-gone
and that adds up to about 1 trillion.... welcome to the third world
The whole debt problem is INFINITELY more complex than your favorite 24 hour cable news channel can even possibly begin to present it to you. There isn't really and way to get to 1.1 trillion dollars more net income to get to 0 if you just tax or cut spending. Its going to require both. If you closed the income tax loopholes, got rid of payable tax credits (we, the taxpayers actually paid GE this year), and reduced other tax deductions (such the home interest deduction should totally go away on houses that cost more than $1 million, put a reasonable limit on green energy tax credits, etc), and include executive pay as company profit for tax purposes (why do executives get paid so much? cuz paying them is an expense on the balance sheet that reduces your "profit") you would generate more revenue (around 500 billion). When the unemployment rate gets closer to 7% we will get more in tax revenue from more people working and paying taxes, and then we will have to cut spending by the rest. That is the starting place to solve the mess here.
/step off soapbox
you are probably right? you must have no idea what the US budget looks like. In FY2010 (ending sept 30 2010) we spent 2.009 trillion dollars on mandatory spending (i.e. we are required by law to pay), such as social security ($695 Billion), medicare ($453 Billion), medicaid ($290 Billion), interest on the debt ($164 Billion), among others. we spent 1.368 trillion dollars on the "discretionary spending" about half of that, $663.7 billion, is the DoD. we took in 2.381 Trillion dollars in revenue (federal taxes and the such). So what is the "expensive crap" we shouldn't buy any more? There are a lot of things that are overspent in the government, but congress just had a fit trying to cut $61 billion.
so you would like to cut more than 75% of the discretionary spending budget? okay we will ENTIRELY cut the following:
DoD ($663.7 billion)- gone
Department of health and human services ($78.7 billion)-gone
Department of transportation ($72.5 billion)-gone
Department of Veterans Affairs ($52.5 billion)-gone
Department of State ($51.7 billion)-gone
Department of Housing and Urban development ($47.5 billion)-gone
Department of Education ($46.7 billion)-gone
and that adds up to about 1 trillion.... welcome to the third world
The whole debt problem is INFINITELY more complex than your favorite 24 hour cable news channel can even possibly begin to present it to you. There isn't really and way to get to 1.1 trillion dollars more net income to get to 0 if you just tax or cut spending. Its going to require both. If you closed the income tax loopholes, got rid of payable tax credits (we, the taxpayers actually paid GE this year), and reduced other tax deductions (such the home interest deduction should totally go away on houses that cost more than $1 million, put a reasonable limit on green energy tax credits, etc), and include executive pay as company profit for tax purposes (why do executives get paid so much? cuz paying them is an expense on the balance sheet that reduces your "profit") you would generate more revenue (around 500 billion). When the unemployment rate gets closer to 7% we will get more in tax revenue from more people working and paying taxes, and then we will have to cut spending by the rest. That is the starting place to solve the mess here.
/step off soapbox
Wanna make it fair? Get rid of sales tax completely. Otherwise, it just makes you look like your trying to find another excuse to tax the people...oh wait.
out of state companies already pay tax in their own state.
so dick durbin wants to tax other states companies for doing business with other states. i believe interstate commerce laws would already have this covered since back in the 1800's with cataloge sales.
brick and motar retailers have a huge advantage, instant gratification of the product right then and there along with hands on displays, that's the main thing that sells a product even if it costs more then else where " get the product into the customers hands right away and your 90% of the way to a sale before they can even think about it." that's a saying that's still true to this day.
the government is broke the odumbacrats need to pay 14.285 trillion dollars and fast or their party will cease to exist because when obamacare takes full affect not only is the national debt going to climb 6.5 trillion per year it's also going to bankrupt the middle class and thus kill what ever economy there is left wtih gas on a course to be $5 per gallon by 4th of july.
i hope for online retailers this one is easy to get out of, they simply move to a state with no income tax or sles tax or leave the country (good old nafta) thus reducing even more tax revenue.
cheaters will just bounce IP's to their swiss bank accounts where there isn't chit the u.s. government can do about it.
that's what i'd like to see happen.
durbin is from a state that hands out all it's tax revenue to welfare, crooks, and who ever contributes the most to a candidates campaign fund, like rezco did with obama for kickbacks in city, county, & state government contracts and aid. illinois is already losing alot of it's big business to other states due to tax issues in illinois.
you're taxed for making money and your taxed for having money and your taxed for using money.
half of what americans make per year goes to taxes unless they have a good accountant.
so dick durbin wants to tax other states companies for doing business with other states. i believe interstate commerce laws would already have this covered since back in the 1800's with cataloge sales.
brick and motar retailers have a huge advantage, instant gratification of the product right then and there along with hands on displays, that's the main thing that sells a product even if it costs more then else where " get the product into the customers hands right away and your 90% of the way to a sale before they can even think about it." that's a saying that's still true to this day.
the government is broke the odumbacrats need to pay 14.285 trillion dollars and fast or their party will cease to exist because when obamacare takes full affect not only is the national debt going to climb 6.5 trillion per year it's also going to bankrupt the middle class and thus kill what ever economy there is left wtih gas on a course to be $5 per gallon by 4th of july.
i hope for online retailers this one is easy to get out of, they simply move to a state with no income tax or sles tax or leave the country (good old nafta) thus reducing even more tax revenue.
cheaters will just bounce IP's to their swiss bank accounts where there isn't chit the u.s. government can do about it.
that's what i'd like to see happen.
durbin is from a state that hands out all it's tax revenue to welfare, crooks, and who ever contributes the most to a candidates campaign fund, like rezco did with obama for kickbacks in city, county, & state government contracts and aid. illinois is already losing alot of it's big business to other states due to tax issues in illinois.
you're taxed for making money and your taxed for having money and your taxed for using money.
half of what americans make per year goes to taxes unless they have a good accountant.
[citation][nom]jprobes[/nom]Wrong, Cutting sales tax and firing 20% of the non military workforce will do nothing but make more people in need of aid from the government and put a huge dent in it's tax revenue.The idea that the "rich" provide us with jobs is the biggest lie the American populace has been fed for 30 years. The rich don't create jobs with tax cuts or subsidies, they pocket the money and put it to work in wall street where they only get taxed 15% on capital gains.That is the biggest problem America has, is revenue. For 30 years the tax code has been slashed and raped by corporations/lobbyist who have made sure that the rich get to keep most of what they make and the poor people foot the bill.Most people chose not to accept this as reality because they have outlandish dreams of being filthy rich and this policy effecting them. That is why taxation is such a taboo subject now in American politics. The rich use the dreams of the poor to fuel their own gains while the masses, oblivious to being used, accept what they are told in one day hoping by choosing to support the rich it wont effect them when they become rich.WRONG, you will never be rich. Not because the "government is out to keep you down" but that unless you invent something are a talented entertainer, it will never happen.When was the last time you heard of a Mechanical Engineer or an Architect becoming an Millionaire? Shit doesn't happen yo.And if you really want to know why jobs have been going overseas for the past 15 years. You can blame Wall Street and their insistence in the form of investment that companies generate larger % of profits year after year.The only way for companies to due that is to increase production without increasing costs, or ship jobs overseas so they don't have to pay the going rate for wages in the US.Why is it that production is at the same levels it was pre-recession, yet unemployment and wages are the same? Why are you mad at the government employees getting pensions and benefits? Shouldn't you be upset that you don't get these in the private sector?At a time where local and state governments are crippled due to massive revenue shortfalls generated from high unemployment, this is probably the best idea next to direct increases on income or property taxes depending on where you live. It mainly will benefit children and the elderly as that is mostly what the government spends its money on, aside from the military.Suck it up and pay the state sales tax on internet purchases along with the shipping. Nothing is free in this world, so quite fucking expecting it.End the American Empire. End the 2 wars, Raise Capital gains to 35% and create a 50% Millionaire tax bracket, End the death tax. (99.9% of Americans will never be effected by this so why should you give a fuck?).Reduce the income gap between the top 1% and the rest of us and put an end to the gross privatization of the government and the services they should be providing. (prisons, schools, energy and the Internet.)Then maybe we can have our tax free internet purchases.[/citation]
gee by your thinking before FDR the u.s. government couldn't survive oh noooos what in the world did they ever do before big government and income tax to pay for socialist policies!
your whole arguement was blown out of the water the moment you opened your mouth.
the real issue is to cut spending and that means end handing out free money to support bums
gee by your thinking before FDR the u.s. government couldn't survive oh noooos what in the world did they ever do before big government and income tax to pay for socialist policies!
your whole arguement was blown out of the water the moment you opened your mouth.
the real issue is to cut spending and that means end handing out free money to support bums
When I shop online here in Canada, I always have to pay taxes 5% to 12% depending on the online-store. If I buy from US or other places, most of the time there's no taxes, but you never know if UPS will come up with a huge fee like 40% of the price.
[citation][nom]shin0bi272[/nom]If you do a LIIIITTLE bit of research you'll see that the top 1% pay 40% of the taxes and the top 25% pay 97.5% of the taxes... the bottom 48% pay NOTHING in taxes...
[/citation]
Seems appropriate, considering the top 20% control 93% of the wealth. And that bottom 48%? Consists of HUNDREDS of MILLIONS of people whose lives are spent funneling what little they make back to the top 20% and the government. If you accept this as a perfectly viable system, you're about as fucked as can be, because THEY have convinced YOU to make their arguments for them, with absolutely no derived benefit for yourself, other than to shit on somebody who is 99.999% likely just as much of an economic pissant as yourself.
[/citation]
Seems appropriate, considering the top 20% control 93% of the wealth. And that bottom 48%? Consists of HUNDREDS of MILLIONS of people whose lives are spent funneling what little they make back to the top 20% and the government. If you accept this as a perfectly viable system, you're about as fucked as can be, because THEY have convinced YOU to make their arguments for them, with absolutely no derived benefit for yourself, other than to shit on somebody who is 99.999% likely just as much of an economic pissant as yourself.
i've heard greater and brighter ideas from yahoo and aol or msn users.
cut aircraft from other branches from the military that's what the airforce is for learn , make them learn to work together or eliminate all the branches and just call it the military. eliminate the coastgaurd ww2 is over this is the navy's job anyways. eliminate the border patrol as this is what the army is for anyways. why have an army if you have marines, why have marines if you have an army.
eliminate government's health care esp. congress and all other politicians all the way to the top as this is what obamacare is for.
An Everyday Example of Why Big Gov't Is Bad
By Hunter Baker on 12.21.10 @ 10:53AM
My favorite pair of glasses has a scratched
lens (despite the much vaunted "no-scratch"
coating). So, I went to Lenscrafters to get
the lens replaced. They asked me when I got
the prescription. It turns out it was a
little over a year ago. "I'm sorry," the
woman at Lenscrafters tells me, "but we
cannot replace the lens because your
prescription has expired."
Let's review the situation. I have a
scratched lens in a pair of glasses which
are working very well for me. I can see
perfectly clearly with the current
prescription which is now just a little
over a year old. State law prohibits
Lenscrafters from replacing the lens. It is
apparently ILLEGAL to replace a lens with a
prescription older than 12 months.
Now, who benefits from a law of this type?
Is it the consumer? No. Is it Lenscrafters?
Not necessarily. They lost the opportunity
to charge me for a replacement lens, though
they may do better from me having to buy
new glasses. But the biggest beneficiary is
optometrists. Thanks to the law causing
prescriptions to LEGALLY expire, I MUST go
to an optometrist to solve my problem.
Through legal (and therefore coercive)
means, the optometrists have made
themselves necessary gatekeepers to me
resolving my personal vision issues even
though I already have a prescription that
works well.
Law is supposed to be made for the common
good. But what we miss is that the
government is an excellent instrument for
profit seeking through regulation. If you
make the government too big and too
important, a variety of interests will go
to the government to find a way to make
their money instead of making it through
customer service, innovation, etc..
another favorite of mine is the gas tax for
using public roads , yet you still have to
pay this for your lawn more, weed whip
chain saw, snowmobiles,4 wheelers, boats
and other things that never drive on the
road.
Consolidate the military forces. Why should the Air Force, Navy and Marine Corps have fighter jets? Why have an Army Infantry and Marine Infantry- Combining of Air and Ground Forces would save Billions.
The Air Force could have the Bombers and Heavy lifters. All fighter pilots would be Aircraft Carrier trained as well as land based. All grunts would be Marine trained with support personnel would be Army trained. And so on. Combine the Coast Guard with the Navy. You would have half the high paid Generals and Admirals, etc. It's doable and time to restructure and cut the duplication and waste.
The collapse of the economy was not the result of natural and unavoidable causes. It was deliberately engineered by the global elite. It resulted in the poor becoming poorer and the middle class increasingly disappearing. But somehow, the very wealthy are still becoming richer. (Go figure!)
The economy will substantially improve when the elite approve of massive infusion of capital into programs designed to help the ordinary citizens and small businesses. Also, the United States needs more trade protections against imports.
The trickle-down economics simply does not work. The banks and investment houses, in collusion with the bonds rating firms deliberately orchestrated a global economic collapse. It is somewhat interesting that the federal government had no problem spending some 12 TRILLION dollars to bailout the financial industry and certain other large corporations. Well, that was like tossing money into a black hole.
Of course, many of those corporations used the bailout funds in ways to benefit themselves, not the general population. They bought back their own stocks and bonds. Those beneficiaries held onto some of the funds, greatly improving their balance sheets’ cash reserves. They traveled the globe to acquire choice assets at bargain-basement prices. And, my personal favorite is... they gave extremely generous, but undeserved pay raises, bonuses and stock options—to especially their top executives. Meanwhile, they continue with company and branch closures, lay-offs, and salary cuts for the lower-level employees.
Too many people don’t have enough income to sufficiently maintain sustained purchasing cycles. Also, they can’t even afford to borrow money; so, the banks won’t lend to them either. However, if you provide substantial funds to the small businesses and the ordinary citizens, then they are more likely to spend it fast domestically. This creates a multiplier effect, which sends ripples of increased economic activity throughout our economy. It results in an almost immediate, substantial, and sustainable economic recovery. Remember, U.S. GDP is almost 75% driven by domestic consumer consumption.
The United States has spent 3 TRILLION on the Iraq war, and more than 1 TRILLION on the Afghanistan war. The 2011 military budget is 721 billion dollars. That figure doesn’t include several hundred billion dollars in other military-related expenditures which are hidden in the budgets of other departments, i.e., Treasury, Department of Energy, and the State Department. Most reliable sources estimate that the total military-related expenditures for 2011 will amount to 1.5 TRILLION dollars. Also, several times each year, the Administration persuades Congress to grant supplemental military funds. Now add to that the annual 300 billion dollars in annual interest expense arising due to the accumulated debt that financed past wars.
It is no small wonder that when it comes to programs and services designed to directly assist the ordinary citizens—the politicians almost invariably complain about the necessity of balancing the budget. (Go figure!)
cut aircraft from other branches from the military that's what the airforce is for learn , make them learn to work together or eliminate all the branches and just call it the military. eliminate the coastgaurd ww2 is over this is the navy's job anyways. eliminate the border patrol as this is what the army is for anyways. why have an army if you have marines, why have marines if you have an army.
eliminate government's health care esp. congress and all other politicians all the way to the top as this is what obamacare is for.
An Everyday Example of Why Big Gov't Is Bad
By Hunter Baker on 12.21.10 @ 10:53AM
My favorite pair of glasses has a scratched
lens (despite the much vaunted "no-scratch"
coating). So, I went to Lenscrafters to get
the lens replaced. They asked me when I got
the prescription. It turns out it was a
little over a year ago. "I'm sorry," the
woman at Lenscrafters tells me, "but we
cannot replace the lens because your
prescription has expired."
Let's review the situation. I have a
scratched lens in a pair of glasses which
are working very well for me. I can see
perfectly clearly with the current
prescription which is now just a little
over a year old. State law prohibits
Lenscrafters from replacing the lens. It is
apparently ILLEGAL to replace a lens with a
prescription older than 12 months.
Now, who benefits from a law of this type?
Is it the consumer? No. Is it Lenscrafters?
Not necessarily. They lost the opportunity
to charge me for a replacement lens, though
they may do better from me having to buy
new glasses. But the biggest beneficiary is
optometrists. Thanks to the law causing
prescriptions to LEGALLY expire, I MUST go
to an optometrist to solve my problem.
Through legal (and therefore coercive)
means, the optometrists have made
themselves necessary gatekeepers to me
resolving my personal vision issues even
though I already have a prescription that
works well.
Law is supposed to be made for the common
good. But what we miss is that the
government is an excellent instrument for
profit seeking through regulation. If you
make the government too big and too
important, a variety of interests will go
to the government to find a way to make
their money instead of making it through
customer service, innovation, etc..
another favorite of mine is the gas tax for
using public roads , yet you still have to
pay this for your lawn more, weed whip
chain saw, snowmobiles,4 wheelers, boats
and other things that never drive on the
road.
Consolidate the military forces. Why should the Air Force, Navy and Marine Corps have fighter jets? Why have an Army Infantry and Marine Infantry- Combining of Air and Ground Forces would save Billions.
The Air Force could have the Bombers and Heavy lifters. All fighter pilots would be Aircraft Carrier trained as well as land based. All grunts would be Marine trained with support personnel would be Army trained. And so on. Combine the Coast Guard with the Navy. You would have half the high paid Generals and Admirals, etc. It's doable and time to restructure and cut the duplication and waste.
The collapse of the economy was not the result of natural and unavoidable causes. It was deliberately engineered by the global elite. It resulted in the poor becoming poorer and the middle class increasingly disappearing. But somehow, the very wealthy are still becoming richer. (Go figure!)
The economy will substantially improve when the elite approve of massive infusion of capital into programs designed to help the ordinary citizens and small businesses. Also, the United States needs more trade protections against imports.
The trickle-down economics simply does not work. The banks and investment houses, in collusion with the bonds rating firms deliberately orchestrated a global economic collapse. It is somewhat interesting that the federal government had no problem spending some 12 TRILLION dollars to bailout the financial industry and certain other large corporations. Well, that was like tossing money into a black hole.
Of course, many of those corporations used the bailout funds in ways to benefit themselves, not the general population. They bought back their own stocks and bonds. Those beneficiaries held onto some of the funds, greatly improving their balance sheets’ cash reserves. They traveled the globe to acquire choice assets at bargain-basement prices. And, my personal favorite is... they gave extremely generous, but undeserved pay raises, bonuses and stock options—to especially their top executives. Meanwhile, they continue with company and branch closures, lay-offs, and salary cuts for the lower-level employees.
Too many people don’t have enough income to sufficiently maintain sustained purchasing cycles. Also, they can’t even afford to borrow money; so, the banks won’t lend to them either. However, if you provide substantial funds to the small businesses and the ordinary citizens, then they are more likely to spend it fast domestically. This creates a multiplier effect, which sends ripples of increased economic activity throughout our economy. It results in an almost immediate, substantial, and sustainable economic recovery. Remember, U.S. GDP is almost 75% driven by domestic consumer consumption.
The United States has spent 3 TRILLION on the Iraq war, and more than 1 TRILLION on the Afghanistan war. The 2011 military budget is 721 billion dollars. That figure doesn’t include several hundred billion dollars in other military-related expenditures which are hidden in the budgets of other departments, i.e., Treasury, Department of Energy, and the State Department. Most reliable sources estimate that the total military-related expenditures for 2011 will amount to 1.5 TRILLION dollars. Also, several times each year, the Administration persuades Congress to grant supplemental military funds. Now add to that the annual 300 billion dollars in annual interest expense arising due to the accumulated debt that financed past wars.
It is no small wonder that when it comes to programs and services designed to directly assist the ordinary citizens—the politicians almost invariably complain about the necessity of balancing the budget. (Go figure!)
So, first I get my check, I apparently don't deserve some of it and am forced to give a portion of what I earn to the government. I then am forced to buy insurance whether I want to or not. Then with the money I have still I can live on, so I buy a house, and am forced to pay the government for it, I need furnishings so I buy them and am forced to pay the government for it. I am a middle class white american and I am forced to give just about half of my money to the government, my point is just that sales tax in general is ridiculous if I am already paying the government before I even get paid.
Is there 1 single government run program that runs efficiently? I can not think of 1, instead of making programs run efficiently, just keep taking more of my money and adding even more bloated money hogging programs that put more people out of business, sounds great!
But seriously, does it ever better anything, or make anything more "fair" to take the one with the advantage, and tell them its no fair that they are doing better? Its like taking 2 sports teams and telling the favorite that since they are better, instead of the other team improving and adapting, that they have to wear ankle weights, that way its fair. Fair for who?!
Is there 1 single government run program that runs efficiently? I can not think of 1, instead of making programs run efficiently, just keep taking more of my money and adding even more bloated money hogging programs that put more people out of business, sounds great!
But seriously, does it ever better anything, or make anything more "fair" to take the one with the advantage, and tell them its no fair that they are doing better? Its like taking 2 sports teams and telling the favorite that since they are better, instead of the other team improving and adapting, that they have to wear ankle weights, that way its fair. Fair for who?!
cpatel1987
Distinguished
- Feb 2, 2010
- 92
- 0
- 18,610
Sales tax doesn't really do much to most people in a psychological perspective of shopping. Because when people shop at retail stores, they see tax as an afterthought. Only occasionally when people have a very strict budget do they actually account for tax when paying for their items. And when comparing to online purchases, they still only see the product price and tend to ignore or completely forget that their $2000 television has $100 in tax (assuming for example 5%). At the end, this law serves only one unfortunate purpose: To compensate for the cuts to the government budget that have already been made. But who can blame them, so many people praise cutting government spending, but very few people realize that doing so also cuts jobs. Yes, the deficits getting worse, but now is actually a terrible time to be dealing with lowering it. Should really be doing that only during good economic times, not bad.
Anyway, politics aside, this won't really put much of a dent in the online shopping world.
Anyway, politics aside, this won't really put much of a dent in the online shopping world.
TheWhiteRose000
Distinguished
- Jul 10, 2010
- 133
- 0
- 18,630
Just another way the US government is trying to suck the money of everyone else.
Rich get Richer, Poor get Poorer.
And Anonymous has more reason's to attack them, and Wikileaks has a reason to bash them.
I vote we trade everyone in the senate out for smart intelligent people.
The Kind that get the joke's on Memebase, and I-am-bored.com
There smarter then them.
Rich get Richer, Poor get Poorer.
And Anonymous has more reason's to attack them, and Wikileaks has a reason to bash them.
I vote we trade everyone in the senate out for smart intelligent people.
The Kind that get the joke's on Memebase, and I-am-bored.com
There smarter then them.
thechief73
Distinguished
- Feb 8, 2010
- 136
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- 18,640
pinnicle329
Distinguished
- Jan 21, 2011
- 3
- 0
- 18,510
Griffolion
Distinguished
- May 28, 2009
- 263
- 0
- 18,930
And in other news, Hitlers grave found empty with note saying "Brb, gone to be a US senator, lol."
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