Need Help Expanding from 2.1 to 5.1

[taytck30692]

I'm looking to expand from a 2.1 system, consisting of a pair of Polk Audio RTi4 and a PSW10, to a 5.1 system. I plan to move the RTi4 to the rear speakers, so I'm looking for a center and front speakers to pair with them.

Anyone have suggestions on what would be good speakers and a center to go with what I have? I have limited space, so I'm thinking of using bookshelf speakers like the Monitor 40s as my front speakers. Would that work?

Thanks for all of your help guys, I really appreciate it.

 

[anwaypasible]

Just because you don't use a center channel doesn't make it right. Hell use any speakers you want. makes no difference to me.

it is because the microphone recording process doesnt use a center or 5.1 setup position that makes me right.

 

[fr8mvr]

http/forum.blu-ray.com/speakers/89614-horizontal-center-channel-speakers-why-they-should-avoided.html

This should keep you busy. Not trying to offend anyone just disagreeing.

 

[fr8mvr]

it is because the microphone recording process doesnt use a center or 5.1 setup position that makes me right.

For music but not for movies.. Were talking about watching TV not listening to music.

 

[fr8mvr]

If a regular center channel doesn't match your front speakers, why does using a tower-center channel have to match your fronts.

The idea is to have all speakers timber matched- meaning all having the same tonal quality.

Edit: Tower in upright position- ok when using matching speakers 2 other towers. Tower on side not ok

 

[anwaypasible]

If a regular center channel doesn't match your front speakers, why does using a tower-center channel have to match your fronts.

the situation you brought out is of no importance as you implied you know already.

the reason the three front speakers need to match is to help the soundstage sound as wide as possible.
some advanced truth..
if your front main speakers are 'fast' and you use a slower center speaker.. you can manipulate the field of air to work in favor for you to over-emphasize the dolby or dts surround sound effect.

my front woofers are faster than my rear woofers.
my rear woofers are ported down to 40hz .. but if i turn the rear speakers on, the bass at 20hz gets louder.

how can 20hz get louder if the rear speakers are not producing much output lower than 40hz ?
because the rear speakers move in and out nanoseconds slower than the front speakers.
when these two soundwaves touch eachother.. they create an overtone harmonic that is slower, and it creates the effect of lower bass.

imagine this..
you have one car doing 40 mph going down the road.
another car doing 30 mph is in the lane next to the car doing 40 mph.
the 30 mph car steers sideways into the other car and forces the 40 mph car to slow down.

same thing with the speaker cones moving at different speeds.


but be warned..
as audio gets clearer and clearer, the different speakers will be unwanted more and more.
timbre is the coldness or warmth of the speaker.
you want these to be the same.

now..
if you want some different speakers up close to the walls.. and a completely different speaker for the center channel.. then together they can smooth out the boominess of the room.
is it a phenomenon?
no.
it is because the speakers in the corners of the room are different phase (not to be confused with positive and negative wires backwards)
phase is anything between 0 - 360 (or more if you count more than 360 angles)
wiring the speakers backwards will seriously ruin something.
but using different speakers for their different phase.. you could get something like 30 degrees different.
sometimes you need 15 degrees different.

you simply cannot be in the center of the room with sound all around you and expect all of that sound to be exactly the same when one speaker doesnt match the timbre of the other speakers.
it is like listening to a male in each corner of the room except one.. and in that 4th corner is a girl.
stand in the middle of the room and try listening to that and the different tones of the voice are going to refuse to blend together.


now think about this..
sometimes a guy and a girl can sound like they are singing the same tone.
that is OCTAVE they are sharing.
if they shared the same tone and octave.. you would hear ONE voice.

the entire point of dolby digital and dts surround sound is to make all of the audio appear as if ONE.
so dont go breaking it because you got your information wrong.

 

[fr8mvr]

the situation you brought out is of no importance as you implied you know already.

the reason the three front speakers need to match is to help the soundstage sound as wide as possible.
some advanced truth..
if your front main speakers are 'fast' and you use a slower center speaker.. you can manipulate the field of air to work in favor for you to over-emphasize the dolby or dts surround sound effect.

my front woofers are faster than my rear woofers.
my rear woofers are ported down to 40hz .. but if i turn the rear speakers on, the bass at 20hz gets louder.

how can 20hz get louder if the rear speakers are not producing much output lower than 40hz ?
because the rear speakers move in and out nanoseconds slower than the front speakers.
when these two soundwaves touch eachother.. they create an overtone harmonic that is slower, and it creates the effect of lower bass.

imagine this..
you have one car doing 40 mph going down the road.
another car doing 30 mph is in the lane next to the car doing 40 mph.
the 30 mph car steers sideways into the other car and forces the 40 mph car to slow down.

same thing with the speaker cones moving at different speeds.


but be warned..
as audio gets clearer and clearer, the different speakers will be unwanted more and more.
timbre is the coldness or warmth of the speaker.
you want these to be the same.

now..
if you want some different speakers up close to the walls.. and a completely different speaker for the center channel.. then together they can smooth out the boominess of the room.
is it a phenomenon?
no.
it is because the speakers in the corners of the room are different phase (not to be confused with positive and negative wires backwards)
phase is anything between 0 - 360 (or more if you count more than 360 angles)
wiring the speakers backwards will seriously ruin something.
but using different speakers for their different phase.. you could get something like 30 degrees different.
sometimes you need 15 degrees different.

you simply cannot be in the center of the room with sound all around you and expect all of that sound to be exactly the same when one speaker doesnt match the timbre of the other speakers.
it is like listening to a male in each corner of the room except one.. and in that 4th corner is a girl.
stand in the middle of the room and try listening to that and the different tones of the voice are going to refuse to blend together.


now think about this..
sometimes a guy and a girl can sound like they are singing the same tone.
that is OCTAVE they are sharing.
if they shared the same tone and octave.. you would hear ONE voice.

the entire point of dolby digital and dts surround sound is to make all of the audio appear as if ONE.
so dont go breaking it because you got your information wrong.

^ spot on^

 

[blackhawk1928]

the situation you brought out is of no importance as you implied you know already.

the reason the three front speakers need to match is to help the soundstage sound as wide as possible.
some advanced truth..
if your front main speakers are 'fast' and you use a slower center speaker.. you can manipulate the field of air to work in favor for you to over-emphasize the dolby or dts surround sound effect.

my front woofers are faster than my rear woofers.
my rear woofers are ported down to 40hz .. but if i turn the rear speakers on, the bass at 20hz gets louder.

how can 20hz get louder if the rear speakers are not producing much output lower than 40hz ?
because the rear speakers move in and out nanoseconds slower than the front speakers.
when these two soundwaves touch eachother.. they create an overtone harmonic that is slower, and it creates the effect of lower bass.

imagine this..
you have one car doing 40 mph going down the road.
another car doing 30 mph is in the lane next to the car doing 40 mph.
the 30 mph car steers sideways into the other car and forces the 40 mph car to slow down.

same thing with the speaker cones moving at different speeds.


but be warned..
as audio gets clearer and clearer, the different speakers will be unwanted more and more.
timbre is the coldness or warmth of the speaker.
you want these to be the same.

now..
if you want some different speakers up close to the walls.. and a completely different speaker for the center channel.. then together they can smooth out the boominess of the room.
is it a phenomenon?
no.
it is because the speakers in the corners of the room are different phase (not to be confused with positive and negative wires backwards)
phase is anything between 0 - 360 (or more if you count more than 360 angles)
wiring the speakers backwards will seriously ruin something.
but using different speakers for their different phase.. you could get something like 30 degrees different.
sometimes you need 15 degrees different.

you simply cannot be in the center of the room with sound all around you and expect all of that sound to be exactly the same when one speaker doesnt match the timbre of the other speakers.
it is like listening to a male in each corner of the room except one.. and in that 4th corner is a girl.
stand in the middle of the room and try listening to that and the different tones of the voice are going to refuse to blend together.


now think about this..
sometimes a guy and a girl can sound like they are singing the same tone.
that is OCTAVE they are sharing.
if they shared the same tone and octave.. you would hear ONE voice.

the entire point of dolby digital and dts surround sound is to make all of the audio appear as if ONE.
so dont go breaking it because you got your information wrong.

I've found the information, but the center sounds good and so what else matters? The sound stage is fine also. Dome-tweeters on my fronts help a great deal. Plus my fronts are much to high, each one is almost 7 feet tall, it would block the TV, but my small tower, around 3-feet tall, I'd be able to get the TV higher easily.

I'm more concerned about the music quality, than movies. If I get the tower as the center, it will sound amazing...

I've got 8 12'' subwoofers
1 8'' subwoofer
19 mid-range speakers
19 tweeters (16 of them are domes which are far less directional)
4 super-tweeters

My sound-stage will be just fine

 

[anwaypasible]

For music but not for movies.. Were talking about watching TV not listening to music.

HEY..

simply because your recording group uses a center channel microphone.. that doesnt mean the rest of the idiots have begun doing it yet.

doesnt matter if you record a center channel with a center microphone if/when the dolby or dts encoder refuses to use that audio information.

a lot of what made dolby and dts special is the fact that you can record something with one or two microphones and chop up all of that audio into fragments that could be sent to each speaker.

if you use two microphones to record the front left and right.. then let the computer software extract the center channel from those two microphone recordings - that audio software would be very special and important RIGHT?

now..
if you feed each speaker channel with a dedicated microphone recording - all of the reverb the audio software does to make the soundwaves blend together perfectly would AGAIN be very special and important right?

extracting audio from a left/right recording isnt always the hardest thing to do.
but
making the three speakers play nice and kind together is going to require more software algorithms than copy and paste.
that is what makes the walls melt and disappear.. the reverb!!
anything else is copy and paste discrete nonsensical compression..or attempts to bloat.



anyways..
that article on the blu-ray forum is talking about two speakers being close to eachother.
the same way those two speakers interact with eachother is the exact same thing about how the speakers interact with the room and other speakers in the room.

it is an attempt to get the people who really care get some really good results with their audio system.. and help other people who dont have the time or are too stupid to figure it all.

 

[blackhawk1928]

The idea is to have all speakers timber matched- meaning all having the same tonal quality.

Edit: Tower in upright position- ok when using matching speakers 2 other towers. Tower on side not ok

Good, so you agree with me