Sony says PS3 Intentionally Hard for Developers

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[citation][nom]Humans think[/nom]See Metal Gear Solid 4 i think they cracked the code of Sony, the game is simply amazing. Moreover due to the excelent hardware built in inside PS3 is still one of the best Blue-Ray players in the market. So before thinking of revenge just buy what is best for your money.[/citation]

I don't know about cracked,it probably cost a fortune to make a game like MGS4,I'm a PC guy and if I had to buy a console it would be the PS3 for the Blue ray player to go with my new 40 inch LCD so the BlueRay player is a major selling point. honestly though I think he is lying when he said they deliberately made it hard for game developers, they put the most powerful hardware in the PS3 thinking the game developers would figure it out like they did with the PS2 but it kind of backfired on them.
 
Well, that explains why 'some' games look better on the Xbox360 when they first came out.

And wit the Xbox720 coming out in 2011-12 you can imagine how powerful and cheap hardware will be by then... the PS3 will be obsolete. things don't look good for a console that cost more to produce then it's MSRP. I really done get sony's logic, usually devs get 1 game in a trilogy per Console, 2 at the most. So why are they making an already difficult task harder???

LESS games made on it means less interest for you and I to buy the PS3, Less PS3's sold means LESS profits for devs, higher man-hours spent to produce and PROGRAM the game means LESS profits for devs...so why would devs ,unless bribed by Sony want to make games on the PS3?
 
In other news SCEI head Kazuo Hirai also declared that Sony had purposefully lost $1.7 billion dollars in order to ensure the company would have plenty of growth to look forward to in the future.
 
i have a PS3. sold my 360. got both on launch day. never had a RROD. much happier with my PS3. i played my PS3's exclusive content a lot more, and game feel more realistic, especially in FIFA and Madden. And the only problem i have with the PS3's online capablility is the slow download speeds, i can't take full advantage of my FiOS. should only take seconds to download firmware updates, instead takes about 12 minutes. i enjoy the ps3 exclusives more than 360's, halo to me is overplayed, and overhyped, and not that great looking for how people have raved about it, the Halo:combat evolved however, still a regular of mine for xbox lan parties. gamespot does a lot of graphics comparisons pointing out jaggies and textures, i dont look that close when i play...im about 8-10 feet away from my screen...the recommended viewing distance, and the colors, blacks, and whites are all more vivid, dark, and bright on the PS3. still have not found a game more interesting than MGS4, or more fun to play online than Resistance 2. waiting for Killzone 2, SF:IV, and GOW III.
 
I own all three. I like the ps3 the best. Wii second and 360 last. I'm tired of having to ship that pos to get fixed. Halo 3 got old quick gears 2 was to short and the same old. I am back into playing metal gear again. I could care less abount quantity... The top ps3 games are without a doubt worth the money I spent on my 60 gig back when it came out
 
It's all marketing spin. Their console is difficult to develop for and they use this as a means to justify it. In light of the fact that PS3 is getting it's butt whooped by the Wii, Mr. seems to be on a press junket of claiming victory despite facts. Recently he was saying that PS3 is the #1 console and dismissing the Wii as competition. It's all posturing.

Meanwhile, regarding the question of platform usage.. my first "next gen" console was the PS3 because I wanted a blu-ray player and frankly the PS3 plays the with better quality than most blu-ray players at that time that cost twice as much, and I got a game console to boot. It's initial capabilities as a network media player initially were embarrassingly pathetic. But these days with the upgrades and TVersity, it serves the job well enough for most folks.

I also have a XBOX 360 but that is pure game console to us, no other function is expected from it and it only ties the PS3 for active playtime. Not that the XBox 360 could not also be a media player, just that role is already filled to our satisfaction so our purchase was purely for game reasons and nothing else.

We have a Wii + Wiifit, making it the most played console at our house, but we don't play any games on it after the initial honeymoon period wears off (just like most folks go through with Wiis) but the Wii Fit leapfrogged it to #1 status because between my wife and I it gets a play session every day, usually one from each of us. So time wise since November, the Wii is now our most played console.

I can understand that Kazuo Hirai has to find some legs to stand on and prop up the poor PS3 sales, especially when Sony is posting operating losses for the first time in 14 years (2.9 billion). The man is trying to save his job and perhaps his division.

Despite all of that, I still rather like my PS3.
 
Now we know why there is a glut of original games. Obviously, the Unreal engine can work well for a bunch of massmarket games - and will serve the purposes of big studios - it's hard to make a game that pushes gameplay forward (on all platforms, these days)
 
It seems to me, Sony is rely saying, we don't care how much the PS3 SDK "software development kit" adds to the cost of your new game. Why should we, that is your risk to take. Sony dose not care about the development cost of third party titles. In fact what we rely want is for third party developers to fail. Sony does not need greedy software developers who fail to realize that it is all about the PS3 hardware and NOT the games you can play. Just look at the endless supply of Sony PS3 Fan boys shouting how great the PS3 is despite the fact that has the fewest good titles of all the consoles. Oh wait, that's why Sony console are getting there teeth kicked in in Europe and the US. Sony screwed the pooch with the PS3 and anyone who looked at the SDK new it was a total cluster-f**k. Sony needs to make some changes in there console division. They can't keep playing like they are the top dog, because they aren't. That ship has sailed. Sony can either make the changes needed or there next console will be there last. A neat piece of hardware with no one writing software for it. We should all have pity on the suckers that buy one of those.
 
I would not be quick to bash Sony for an article stating an opinion, that stems from another article with quotes translated from an another language (especially an eastern one). Too much room for misleading information.

The fact is that the PS3, is a way superior console technically speaking. Its design is superior, and its power as well. Perhaps the fact that it uses a Cell BE Processor, is what is throwing developers off. It does not operate like a normal processor, so certain tasks need to be developed differently, to take full advantage of its power. This is why you will find many researchers, and scientists using them (with their own software, which puts its power to use). I read an article stating that facial image recognition is 27 times faster on the PS3 Cell BE Processor than an Intel Core2 Duo. TWENTY SEVEN. You can find many examples of what others have hacked the PS3 to do, including supercomputing.

The fact is, its a steal to get that hardware for the price. The Xbox is rather lame in comparison, and like it is stated in the referring article, the wii... well its really its own category. In my opinion, both Nintendo and Sony are industry leaders, wii killed by thinking out of the box, and being creative -- Sony developed a console with specs that when fully used, will create amazing results.

Personally, I got my eye on the revised version coming soon. Price should drop, it should be quieter, will consume less power. Other than playing games, def. will install linux, and will be used mostly as a media center/dvr.
 
I think he is correct. I believe the reason Sony is getting attacked so harsh is they are forcing Ms to upgrade there console because of Blu Ray they know they can only hold out so long Ms has to do it first You know Sony won't. So i agree and approve of this message. As far as the topic of the development I believe they are correct it makes Developers work, so it fans out the trash as you would call it. It is a risky plan, but the way it works it is working making alot of news against them. Usually when threatened is when things lash out and I noticed alot of lashing out.
 
Perhaps the PS3's (and Sony's) fates might have been a bit better off had Sony not assumed that innertia from the PS1 and PS2 would keep them on top this generation, and instead, did what kept them successful, and focused on a platform that lagged behind some others in terms of graphics and processing power, but presented a platform that was inexpensive to own, and compelling as a media device. (the PS1's CD player, and bigger yet, the PS2's DVD player)

It's true that at first, the high cost of the Blu-Ray player was a major factor in the PS3's high cost, but also present were Sony's insistence on using a fully-scaled CBE CPU, which is NEVER utilized for gaming. The CBE is good for 32-bit single-precision floating-point used for decoding and encoding streaming media, but horrific at 64-bit double-precision floating-point that's actually used in games; a lot of Core2Duos, (like the E8400) and all Core2Quads and Core i7s best it there. (that, and even harvesting THAT much power from the PS3 requires programming for no fewer than 7 hardware threads, compared to 2-4) For what it does, it was a massive waste; it's utter overkill for handling high-def media, even with some filters used. And of course, it wasn't necessary to cram the highest-end filtering into a $500-600US device; kinda sheer idiocy to make what was one of the cheapest players of the time by far the best. Better to simply make it merely sufficient to handle it without taking quality-degrading "shortcuts," and hence make it cheaper to produce.

Also, they might've made a few better choices for the graphics sub-system. With the GPU having access to only 256MB of video RAM directly, it has to steal anything further from the CPU's pool of XDRAM, which comes at VASTLY lower memory bandwidth, and bandwidth which is ALSO stolen from the CPU's usage. This actually more or less entails that the PS3's graphical capabilies, in many games, actually lag behind the Xbox 360, in spite of being more expensive. It's slightly offset by the fact that as the RSX GPU is, more or less, just a cut-down G71, it cannot use Anti-Aliasing in any games using HDR, more or less freeing up some graphics processing power that's normally taken on the Xbox 360 and its mandate that all games use AA on it. This is usually shown as higher resolutions; virtually all PS3 games can actually run natively at 1280x720 without using a sub-HD resolution and upscaling to 720p like the Xbox 360 does. (Halo 3 is some 1138x640, and Oblivion&Fallout 3 are a mere 1024x576)

An "unintended and unfortunate" consequence of some of these cutbacks is that it might've been a bit easier to get the full power out of the PS3, by making it a tad simpler. Of course, also partly because there'd be less power to exploit, but that sort of potential is really one that can't be reasonably made use of in a normal game; if it DOES use up that much processing power, it's because something's hideously unoptimized.
 
oh how i doubt anyone will be reading my comment, but has anyone noticed that sony has been sounding very pessimistic lately? they attacked xbox's price point, and it was really pathetic IMO... microsoft's reponse was a little more mature though, they said 'we rather not tell people why the other console sucks, but why ours is better'... the ps3 is a nice console, but this is irritating to read.. the actual article is at 1up.com, don't have a direct link though
 
I do like the PS3, but Kaz is retarded and looks homo. He should really stop embarrassing his employer with his idiocy.
 
[citation][nom]sacre[/nom]Hah, imo, they took the wrong approach.I mean, evidance lies in the numbers as we discuss.. PS3 is what, third? out of the 3 that are out there. For one, why make it difficult? You WANT all the subpar games + big games on your console.. because if you don't have the subpar games, what do you play between the larger more intense games?Play a big game...wait 8 months..play another big game..wait 2 months.. etc..orPlay big game, play 50 mini games, play big game, play 55 mini games..Really I don't see their logic behind this, I think they're just making excuses.[/citation]

That's the strategy that made the PS1 so successful. It had mountains of crap games, but it helps sell more systems since someone is going to like it. One of the things that made it easy to code for was it's increased RAM over the Saturn and decent programing tools.

Sega had a similar PS3 type strategy with the Saturn, make something that's more powerful than anything else, which also made it too difficult to code for because it was done poorly, and then don't support the developers because you're saving the best tools for yourself. Yeah it didn't work for the Saturn and it's not gonna work for the PS3. Just like the saturn it's too expensive, which gives it too small a base, which means most developers aren't going to spend their time trying to get the most out of the PS3 because they are afraid they aren't going to sell enough copies to get back the money it took to make such a game.

You have more games and cheaper systems, you sell more systems, which gives you a bigger install base. Having that bigger install base means developers can sell more games, so they are more likely to try and get the most out of that system because they know it will be worth the investment. From that you get kick ass games which sells you even more systems.
 
Gee... I can't help, but comment on this article and responses. I also believe that Sony didn't explain themselves well in this interview. "Intentionally" making the hardware hard to program for? It's their way of trying to explain to the general consumers the idea behind their technology/product.

Lets throw in a little background:

Everyone must understand the trends behind computing. Not everyone understands that we have exhausted the GHz race that's been going on for the last decades in processor development. The trends now have gone to multithreaded/multicore and another variety Cell processors. This trend is very new (Thus one of the other article covers PS3 is still in early adopters phase which it is). The majority of the applications that takes advantage of this at this point are professional applications that costs thousands of dollars. Being a computer engineer I see Sony's reasoning.

What does this have to do with the article:

With that information in the background I would have to tell you that its such a pain to program multithreaded applications. There are still tons of research being done about this issue. The multithreaded applications released so far shows dramatic performance advantages. Sony envisions this from their console once developers gets used to this new idea.

Now many will ask that why does the Xbox 360 so easy to program for? It's got three cores inside of its general purpose cpu?

People have to understand that the Xbox processor have its three general purpose processors in series with the idea to enhance its pipelining ability and thus increase it's throughput. So in the developers point of view they only see and use one thread enabled processor which a lot of developers know how to program for.

The cell processor has 1 general purpose CPU with 7 SPE's in parallel. This means it can do more per clock(its like comparing the Xbox 360's processor as one really big pipe to Sony's 7 decently sized pipes if you force water though it there's higher flow rate out of Sony's pipes with the disadvantage of programing difficulty). The only problem is very little knows how to program for it.

Sony's trying to reap the benefits of this. Remember a long time ago when Sony released the first transistor radio. That is how Sony was founded. No one believed in transistor technology since they had all their awesome vacuum tube radios(lol sorry for comparing Xbox to a vacuum radio as thats all I can thing of for now). It wasn't until several years later that people realized the transistors advantages in less power consumption and compactness. This was the point where Sony took of. It's in Sony's interest to create something that's "never been done before".

About the future:

There is no doubt that the "Xbox 720" will surpass the Playstation 3. The only thing that I see happening here is that Microsoft will look better (to the general consumers eyes) as I can see them jumping in the parallel computing bandwagon with their nextgen x2 console when the developers have honed their parallel programming skills from todays multicore computers and possibly the Playstation. I just hope that the consumers will remember Sony's effort in all of this.

Sorry if it may seem like I've written this very quickly as I did because I'm stuffy and sick at the moment.

Btw I don't own either one of the consoles. Just wanting to voice out what I know.
 
This feels like an excuse for why the console isn't doing so well. Maybe they did make it hard for the right reasons, but their timing in telling us this was less than ideal (like I said, feels like an excuse).
 
The platform isn't the only problem facing developers, making PS3 games, as Sony in their licence has the right to stop a game all the way to the launch date. On the positive side it means all games are approved by Sony on the bad it increases the risk which might make developers think again before using their talents with the platform. Especially since niether Nintendo or Microsoft demands that right.
 
So that explains why the PS3's browser still goes out of memory and locks on Delicious and YouTube.

So I can look forward to many years of Sony's developers growing into their breeches before I can use my PS3's supposedly capable browser and, dare I say it, perhaps even listen to internet radio stations?

Well, at least the browser uses most of the 1080p real estate now, rather than 600x480 so now someone's "taking things to the next level".

Txs for clearing that up, Kaz.
 
Wow what a lame excuse that is. The real truth is Sony are snobs who want total control over their "superior" product. They don't care about the end consumer because they are so focussed on stroking their own egos. They have lost sight of what the market wants which is why they are trailing in a distant third place. Anyone who thinks this will be turned around are being overly optimistic, Sony are too pompous to admit to their mistakes and do the right thing, hence this lamest of excuses along with the idea a 2 year old console is still for early adopters. They are living in cockcoo-land.
 
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