is current lens for dSLR compatible with future full frame..

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Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Say if I want to buy "CANON EF-S 17-85MM4.0-5.6 IS USM" for XT. I am
wondering after few years whether this lens is still compatible with
future full frame body? Afterall, many prosumer will spend lot of
money for this. It's hard to predict the future, but is it
mechanically possible?

If these kind of lens are designed for crop ratio 1.6, why don't they
just say "CANON EF-S 27.2 - 136 ...".

Thank you,
Alfred

 

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Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

alfredwang123@gmail.com (A W) writes:

> Say if I want to buy "CANON EF-S 17-85MM4.0-5.6 IS USM" for XT. I am
> wondering after few years whether this lens is still compatible with
> future full frame body? Afterall, many prosumer will spend lot of
> money for this. It's hard to predict the future, but is it
> mechanically possible?

I don't think that EF-S lenses will be compatible with full time
bodies. Mirror will be in the way ... But EF ones should.

> If these kind of lens are designed for crop ratio 1.6, why don't they
> just say "CANON EF-S 27.2 - 136 ...".

What if they increase the sensor size and therefore reduce the crop factor
to, say, 1.25? Would you retract all lenses from the market to re-label
them? What if you own both cameras, one with 1.6 crop ratio, one with 1.25?

It would be too confusing.

Bye, Dragan

--
Dragan Cvetkovic,

To be or not to be is true. G. Boole No it isn't. L. E. J. Brouwer

!!! Sender/From address is bogus. Use reply-to one !!!

 

[Darrell]

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

"A W" <alfredwang123@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:f3b9da2a.0503141449.80ad2d0@posting.google.com...
> Say if I want to buy "CANON EF-S 17-85MM4.0-5.6 IS USM" for XT. I am
> wondering after few years whether this lens is still compatible with
> future full frame body? Afterall, many prosumer will spend lot of
> money for this. It's hard to predict the future, but is it
> mechanically possible?
>
> If these kind of lens are designed for crop ratio 1.6, why don't they
> just say "CANON EF-S 27.2 - 136 ...".
>
You don't have to worry, Canon has no intention of making a consumer level
24x36mm sensor dSLR. Witness the increased number of EF-S lenses being
released. Full frame 35mm sized sensors won't be affordable, besides the
"L-Series" glass isn't all that affordable any ways...

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

> Say if I want to buy "CANON EF-S 17-85MM4.0-5.6 IS USM" for XT. I am
> wondering after few years whether this lens is still compatible with
> future full frame body? Afterall, many prosumer will spend lot of
> money for this. It's hard to predict the future, but is it
> mechanically possible?
>
> If these kind of lens are designed for crop ratio 1.6, why don't they
> just say "CANON EF-S 27.2 - 136 ...".

I'll throw in one more consideration: Edge quality. Now all of this may
be wrong, I'm open to being corrected!

Some of the aberrations that occur with lenses (as part of the inherant
nature of lens design, trade-offs HAVE to be made) get worse near the edge
of the image - vignetting, distortion, softness, etc.. With either the EF
or EF-S lenses, they're designed to try and keep those aberrtions within at
least acceptable ranges near the edges of the projected image. When you
talk about getting a lens where these aberrations are less apparent near the
edges, you start talking a LOT of money.

So... with an EF lens projecting a larger image, the design criteria call
for keeping those aberrations below some level over a larger area, and when
you use it on a smaller APS-C sensor, the sensor is only seeing the best
part of the image - the part in the middle, the worst part (the edges)
aren't captured. I don't know if the EF-S lenses are designed to perform
equally well over the entire APS-C area as the EF lenses do - but if I had
to pick which would do the best, the EF would seem a safer bet than the
EF-S. Plus, as other point out, the EF lenses can be used on a film body (a
cheap film body might be something you'll want) or, if the price ever comes
down, on full-frame digitals.

Of course, as always, I could be entirely wrong, and if so, I'd love an
explanation of where I went wrong!

steve

 

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Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

On 14 Mar 2005 14:49:05 -0800, A W <alfredwang123@gmail.com> wrote:
> Say if I want to buy "CANON EF-S 17-85MM4.0-5.6 IS USM" for XT. I am
> wondering after few years whether this lens is still compatible with
> future full frame body? Afterall, many prosumer will spend lot of
> money for this. It's hard to predict the future, but is it
> mechanically possible?

I don't think so. The imaging circle that it projects is too small.

> If these kind of lens are designed for crop ratio 1.6, why don't they
> just say "CANON EF-S 27.2 - 136 ...".

For the same reason that a normal lens for an 8x10 camera isn't
sold as a "50". APS-C is as real a format as anything else, we
don't need to discuss everything in terms of 35mm.

This is to a large extent a matter of taste. My taste is for things
that are what they say they are. The lens in question offers focal
lengths from 17 to 85 mm, and I prefer that it be labeled as such.
I have not used 35mm extensively, and I have no trouble remembering
that a 30mm lens is "normal". Your mileage may vary.

Regards,

--
Ben Rosengart (212) 741-4400 x215
Sometimes it only makes sense to focus our attention on those
questions that are equal parts trivial and intriguing.
--Josh Micah Marshall

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

On Mon, 14 Mar 2005 19:01:07 -0500, "Darrell" <dev/null> wrote:

>
>"A W" <alfredwang123@gmail.com> wrote in message
>news:f3b9da2a.0503141449.80ad2d0@posting.google.com...
>> Say if I want to buy "CANON EF-S 17-85MM4.0-5.6 IS USM" for XT. I am
>> wondering after few years whether this lens is still compatible with
>> future full frame body? Afterall, many prosumer will spend lot of
>> money for this. It's hard to predict the future, but is it
>> mechanically possible?
>>
>> If these kind of lens are designed for crop ratio 1.6, why don't they
>> just say "CANON EF-S 27.2 - 136 ...".
>>
>You don't have to worry, Canon has no intention of making a consumer level
>24x36mm sensor dSLR. Witness the increased number of EF-S lenses being
>released. Full frame 35mm sized sensors won't be affordable, besides the
>"L-Series" glass isn't all that affordable any ways...

That's an odd statement as there are L lenses which when combined with
the 20D body have it come in with a few bucks of the it with EF-S
17-85 kit lenses. The body with a 17-40 F4.0L comes in at 2049 or
with the 70-200 F4.0L at 1949.

Both these lenses are far better than any of the EF-S lenses.


********************************************************

"A nice man is a man of nasty ideas."

_Introductions to History of the Reformation_
Jonathan Swift
1667-1745

 

[Darrell]

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

"John A. Stovall" <johnastovall@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:8n9c311e1u39nqdk4rddd549biov5gr7n2@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 14 Mar 2005 19:01:07 -0500, "Darrell" <dev/null> wrote:
>
> >
> >"A W" <alfredwang123@gmail.com> wrote in message
> >news:f3b9da2a.0503141449.80ad2d0@posting.google.com...
> >> Say if I want to buy "CANON EF-S 17-85MM4.0-5.6 IS USM" for XT. I am
> >> wondering after few years whether this lens is still compatible with
> >> future full frame body? Afterall, many prosumer will spend lot of
> >> money for this. It's hard to predict the future, but is it
> >> mechanically possible?
> >>
> >> If these kind of lens are designed for crop ratio 1.6, why don't they
> >> just say "CANON EF-S 27.2 - 136 ...".
> >>
> >You don't have to worry, Canon has no intention of making a consumer
level
> >24x36mm sensor dSLR. Witness the increased number of EF-S lenses being
> >released. Full frame 35mm sized sensors won't be affordable, besides the
> >"L-Series" glass isn't all that affordable any ways...
>
> That's an odd statement as there are L lenses which when combined with
> the 20D body have it come in with a few bucks of the it with EF-S
> 17-85 kit lenses. The body with a 17-40 F4.0L comes in at 2049 or
> with the 70-200 F4.0L at 1949.
>
> Both these lenses are far better than any of the EF-S lenses.
>
True, but I have sold very few to people with a Digital Rebel. I do sell
them to people with the 10D or 20D more often. But as we now have a EF-S
60mm macro, when the previous EF versions gave more macro 1:1 on film is
like 1.6:1 on digital, so Canon now cuts that back to a 1:1 on digital only.
The future looks clear for APS-C sensors. There is no reason for Canon to
re-tool lenses if they intended to drop APS-C in a few years.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

On Mon, 14 Mar 2005 20:25:19 -0500, "Darrell" <dev/null> wrote:

>
>"John A. Stovall" <johnastovall@earthlink.net> wrote in message
>news:8n9c311e1u39nqdk4rddd549biov5gr7n2@4ax.com...
>> On Mon, 14 Mar 2005 19:01:07 -0500, "Darrell" <dev/null> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >"A W" <alfredwang123@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> >news:f3b9da2a.0503141449.80ad2d0@posting.google.com...
>> >> Say if I want to buy "CANON EF-S 17-85MM4.0-5.6 IS USM" for XT. I am
>> >> wondering after few years whether this lens is still compatible with
>> >> future full frame body? Afterall, many prosumer will spend lot of
>> >> money for this. It's hard to predict the future, but is it
>> >> mechanically possible?
>> >>
>> >> If these kind of lens are designed for crop ratio 1.6, why don't they
>> >> just say "CANON EF-S 27.2 - 136 ...".
>> >>
>> >You don't have to worry, Canon has no intention of making a consumer
>level
>> >24x36mm sensor dSLR. Witness the increased number of EF-S lenses being
>> >released. Full frame 35mm sized sensors won't be affordable, besides the
>> >"L-Series" glass isn't all that affordable any ways...
>>
>> That's an odd statement as there are L lenses which when combined with
>> the 20D body have it come in with a few bucks of the it with EF-S
>> 17-85 kit lenses. The body with a 17-40 F4.0L comes in at 2049 or
>> with the 70-200 F4.0L at 1949.
>>
>> Both these lenses are far better than any of the EF-S lenses.
>>
>True, but I have sold very few to people with a Digital Rebel. I do sell

I wouldn't expect a Rebel buyer to see the advantage of the "L"
lenses.

>them to people with the 10D or 20D more often. But as we now have a EF-S
>60mm macro, when the previous EF versions gave more macro 1:1 on film is
>like 1.6:1 on digital, so Canon now cuts that back to a 1:1 on digital only.
>The future looks clear for APS-C sensors. There is no reason for Canon to
>re-tool lenses if they intended to drop APS-C in a few years.

No, but I plan to move to a full frame sensor in a few years. So, I
see no use for an EF-S now unless it would be the 10-20.
*******************************************************

"Hey, kemosabe! Long time no see.
Hey sport. You connect the dots.
You pick up the pieces."

"Sharkey's Night"
by
Laurie Anderson
_Home of the Brave_

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

"A W" <alfredwang123@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:f3b9da2a.0503141449.80ad2d0@posting.google.com...
> If these kind of lens are designed for crop ratio 1.6, why don't they
> just say "CANON EF-S 27.2 - 136 ...".

Because it isn't.

The focal length is exactly what it says it is.
Lenses have always been available that will fit a number of different
formats.
I used "35mm" camera lenses on my 16mm cine cameras. The field of view was
significantly different, giving me good long telephotos - but no wideangles
at all.
On my 6x7 Mamiya RB the "standard" lens is around 90 - 127mm. 50mm is a
decent wide-angle.
Half-frame cameras were around long before APS. Same effect when using "35mm
film" lenses..
Just accept that you have bought an APS equivalent and not a 35mm camers.
Why would you want the lens manufacturer to lie about the focal length when
in reality the photographer ought to know what format film he is using? As
tecnology advances and standards change it's up to us to understand and
appreciate the differences.