The Laserdisc format in 2005 and beyond...

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.laserdisc (More info?)

Hi All

I'm a newcomer to the usenet scene so bear with me if I'm talking
drivel or repeating a conversation you had last week. Its great to see
this group so active and that we have so many LD devotees still out
there. I've been into Laserdiscs for over a year now, you can say I was
a late embracer of the technology ) Having purchased a player and
discs on ebay, I've never looked back, and now I buy and sell them on
ebay as a hobby.

I think the format is great. Tactile objects, great cover art, great
picture quality on a well mastered disc, stunning audio, those ohhh so
lavish box sets, I could go on. Most of the people who know me think
I'm mad, but they soon change their tune when they experience a good
AC3/DTS & THX mastered disc in full tilt. I'm not saying that DVD isn't
superb in its own right, its just that there's something about LD's, I
can quite put my finger on it, maybe its cause I'm old enough to
remember vinyl )

So, I wonder what will happen to LD's over the next few years. Will
people be desperate to sell off collections and trade up to more modern
formats? With the production of new players now over, will existing
ones end up fetching stupidly high prices? I've almost given up on
getting a HLD-X9 for a half decent price already! And good old 'Laser
Rot' - A subject that has had many discussions i'm sure - Searching
back through the posts here shows that people were really concerned
about it a few years back - I wont say I haven't come across it, as I
have, but I wonder if the mid to late 90's pressings will have shown
any problems by now and wont deteriorate further on the shelf. I would
love to think I could enjoy my collection for years to come. Do people
think that discs themselves will become more valuable in the future?
With the number of LD only titles getting smaller and smaller, as
releases finally make their way to DVD, what do you think will happen
to their value? Even a common title like Aladdin fetched far more when
it was LD only.

I just wondered what LD devotees can see in their crystal balls )
Looking forward to hearing some views.

Oh, and before I forget, a big thanks to Julien Wilk and all of the
members at lddb for making it my definitive source of information on
all things Laser.

My regards, Mark

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.laserdisc (More info?)

> LunarJetman1970 <gelboy_goughie@hotmail.com> wrote:

> I just wondered what LD devotees can see in their
> crystal balls )

By 2015, all LDs will have succumbed to laser rot,
and will be shrinkwrapped to skids and stacked in
alleyways for recycling.

This was all revealed to us in "Back to the Future,
Part II".

--
Regards, Bob Niland mailto:name@ispname.tld
http/www.access-one.com/rjn email4rjn AT yahoo DOT com
NOT speaking for any employer, client or Internet Service Provider.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.laserdisc (More info?)

I've been into LDs for less than a year, and I totally agree - there's
something about them. They are very cool. I originally bought an LD player
for a couple laserdisc ONLY concert videos, but I've since been buying LDs
left and right. I agree, a well-mastered disc looks about as good as DVD,
if not better because it's not compressed.

BTW, I think they fixed the laser rot problem in the 90's. It was the glue
they used to hold them together, I read.

-Mike

 

[TB]

Archived from groups: alt.video.laserdisc (More info?)

"half_eaten" wrote:

> I've been into LDs for less than a year, and I totally agree - there's
> something about them. They are very cool. I originally bought an LD player
> for a couple laserdisc ONLY concert videos, but I've since been buying LDs
> left and right. I agree, a well-mastered disc looks about as good as DVD,
> if not better because it's not compressed.
>
> BTW, I think they fixed the laser rot problem in the 90's. It was the glue
> they used to hold them together, I read.

LD titles that were known, consistant rotters were being sold right up to
the media's end around early 2000. "Starship Troopers" and "Contact" are two
good examples. I've gone through 4 copies of ST.

T.B.

 

[TB]

Archived from groups: alt.video.laserdisc (More info?)

"Bob Niland" wrote:

>> LunarJetman1970 <gelboy_goughie@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I just wondered what LD devotees can see in their
>> crystal balls )
>
> By 2015, all LDs will have succumbed to laser rot,
> and will be shrinkwrapped to skids and stacked in
> alleyways for recycling.

That reminds me of Pioneer's "fire sales" at their Southern California
warehouse around 1997 - 1998. There would be a low key announcement for a
one day sale usually on a Saturday and you'd go to the warehouse near
Torrance and there'd be about 300 people lined up, some with shopping carts.
They'd open the doors and it was just insane. People would just jam in and
grab LDs as if they were pieces of gold. There'd be pallets with stacks of
titles like the various Star Trek series LDs, box sets like the "Amadeus"
and "Platoon"sets, just thousands of Pioneer produced or pressed titles
discounted up to 90% off retail.

I think Universal in conjunction with a major LD retailer had one or two
similar sales as well in some tent near their studio backlot. I remember
picking up the "Jaws" box for 10 bucks and the Criterion CAV "Akira" for $20
there. I know a major LD/Home Theater store in Yorba Linda, CA also had a
couple great LD fire sales as well.

I think I bought a third of my total LD collection in juts a couple month's
time during those sales thinking I was getting a great deals buying a movie
for 20 bucks instead of 40 or even 99 bucks for a nice special edition box.

DVD prices have sure put that in perspective.

T.B.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.laserdisc (More info?)

"LunarJetman1970" <gelboy_goughie@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1109728576.814466.136270@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
> And good old 'Laser
> Rot' - A subject that has had many discussions i'm sure - Searching
> back through the posts here shows that people were really concerned
> about it a few years back - I wont say I haven't come across it, as I
> have, but I wonder if the mid to late 90's pressings will have shown
> any problems by now and wont deteriorate further on the shelf.

As a rule, if a disc is a "rotter" it will show signs within the first
two years of its manufacture. Since the last laserdisc was produced
almost 4 years ago, if a disc you own doesn't show rot by this point you
should be safe.

"half_eaten" <half_eaten@nospam.yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:ff027c37d2587eb969541460867d50cd@localhost.talkaboutvideo.com...
> BTW, I think they fixed the laser rot problem in the 90's. It was the
> glue
> they used to hold them together, I read.

The Sony DADC plant (aka "the rot factory") had problems right up until
the day they closed the doors. Stay away from Sony discs to lessen your
changes of running into laser rot.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.laserdisc (More info?)

All I know is all of my Pioneer releases are fantastic. I have noticed
minor rolling lines on one of my pioneer discs, and that same one also has
those white specks(i.e. video noise) but the others are practically
perfect.

I have a disc playing in my player right now actually, it's made by Warner
Reprise and the quality is unbelievable. No picture noise, no laser rot...
on the black screens it's absolutely flawless pure black. looks
incredible!

-Mike

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.laserdisc (More info?)

>
> That reminds me of Pioneer's "fire sales" at their Southern
California
> warehouse around 1997 - 1998. There would be a low key announcement
for a
> one day sale usually on a Saturday and you'd go to the warehouse near

> Torrance and there'd be about 300 people lined up, some with shopping
carts.
> They'd open the doors and it was just insane. People would just jam
in and
> grab LDs as if they were pieces of gold. There'd be pallets with
stacks of
> titles like the various Star Trek series LDs, box sets like the
"Amadeus"
> and "Platoon"sets, just thousands of Pioneer produced or pressed
titles
> discounted up to 90% off retail.
>
> I think Universal in conjunction with a major LD retailer had one or
two
> similar sales as well in some tent near their studio backlot. I
remember
> picking up the "Jaws" box for 10 bucks and the Criterion CAV "Akira"
for $20
> there. I know a major LD/Home Theater store in Yorba Linda, CA also
had a
> couple great LD fire sales as well.
>
> I think I bought a third of my total LD collection in juts a couple
month's
> time during those sales thinking I was getting a great deals buying a
movie
> for 20 bucks instead of 40 or even 99 bucks for a nice special
edition box.
>
> DVD prices have sure put that in perspective.
>

Thats amazing. We were lucky to see Laserdiscs in this country full
stop, let alone at knock down prices like that, I would have been one
of those raving madmen trying to grab all I could for sure lol.... I
played my copy of BLOWN AWAY the other night, and still stuck to the
paper sleeve was the store price ticket - I bought the disc on ebay for
next to nothing, but there it was, an original price of £75.00..
GULP... Around 150 dollars in todays conversion. Is it no wonder the
format struggled in the UK!!?

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.laserdisc (More info?)

LOL, Nice one Bob. Well, I guess I can use all of my poly lined sleeves
for my Vinyl Collection hehe.. And the elephant condoms, well, I guess
I can just ship those off to the zoo! I'd forgotten about that scene in
Back to The Future, I must get hold of a copy now.. off to search ebay
) Oh, and by the way. Great FAQ. Loads of useful info in there,
thanks.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.laserdisc (More info?)

> So, I wonder what will happen to LD's over the next few years. Will
> people be desperate to sell off collections and trade up to more
modern
> formats? With the production of new players now over, will existing
> ones end up fetching stupidly high prices? I've almost given up on
> getting a HLD-X9 for a half decent price already! And good old 'Laser
> Rot' - A subject that has had many discussions i'm sure - Searching
> back through the posts here shows that people were really concerned
> about it a few years back - I wont say I haven't come across it, as I
> have, but I wonder if the mid to late 90's pressings will have shown
> any problems by now and wont deteriorate further on the shelf. I
would
> love to think I could enjoy my collection for years to come. Do
people
> think that discs themselves will become more valuable in the future?
> With the number of LD only titles getting smaller and smaller, as
> releases finally make their way to DVD, what do you think will happen
> to their value? Even a common title like Aladdin fetched far more
when
> it was LD only.
>
> I just wondered what LD devotees can see in their crystal balls )
> Looking forward to hearing some views.
>

It's interesting that through all of the questions I raised in my
original post, the one that most people picked up on was dreaded Laser
Rot. I take it that it is still something that people still have strong
opinions on - I'll be honest, I have over 1000 discs now and I'm only
seeing a rot percentage of around 1% - I own good copies of Eraser,
Beauty & The Beast WIP, Starship Troopers, Airforce One, Fargo etc, but
I wont deny that I've had rotted versions of them too.

On a seperate note, and only owners of Analogue PAL Laservision 1980's
discs will probably know, as I've never seen an NTSC one go the same
way -What causes some of the discs to go a bronzey colour and get
mottled 'watermarks' under the disc surface? A lot of these look
absolutely sh*te but still play!

Nice to see people are still interested in LD's. Any more views on the
future? Would love to hear what people think. See my original post.

Nice chatting with you all. M.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.laserdisc (More info?)

> So, I wonder what will happen to LD's over the next few years. Will
> people be desperate to sell off collections and trade up to more
modern
> formats?

I picked up my first LD player in 1995. Like everyone else I eventually
went with DVD, but I still have a larger number of Laserdiscs. I picked
up quite a few over the last few years when all the stores were dumping
their stocks and people were dumping their collections at the local A/V
stores. Although obviously in most cases DVDs are superior, i'm still
quite happy with the quality of LD. I don't think i'll be ditching my
collection anytime soon. I think LD will continue on as a hobbiest
niche for the forseeable future. People still collect and watch CEDs
and Beta, both formats have been mostly defunct for years. [Yes, betas
were available mail order for a long time, but still].

But with about 700-800 discs (i lost count long ago) My laserdiscs will
sit next to my DVDs for quite sometime.

- numsix
- www.villagebbs.com

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.laserdisc (More info?)

On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 20:21:30 -0600, Bob Niland <email4rjn@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> LunarJetman1970 <gelboy_goughie@hotmail.com> wrote:

>> I just wondered what LD devotees can see in their
>> crystal balls )

>By 2015, all LDs will have succumbed to laser rot,
>and will be shrinkwrapped to skids and stacked in
>alleyways for recycling.
bullshit.

Maybe every LD you'e seen was defective, but most aren't.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.laserdisc (More info?)

In the UK, as far as I remember, you were looking at anything between
20 - 60 pounds (approx $40 - $120) on average for a normal release, and
box sets went into hundreds. Of course, once DVD took a hold the few
shops in the UK that stocked them were pretty desperate to shift them
so prices came down in the sales. For me, I never seem to remember them
slowly dissapearing though, it was almost overnight, one day shops had
LD sections, the next, nothing..... Strange....

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.laserdisc (More info?)

In article <%vaVd.35469$xX3.20893@twister.socal.rr.com>,
partyslammer@socal.rr.com says...

> That reminds me of Pioneer's "fire sales" at their Southern California
> warehouse around 1997 - 1998. There would be a low key announcement for a
> one day sale usually on a Saturday and you'd go to the warehouse near
> Torrance and there'd be about 300 people lined up, some with shopping carts.
> They'd open the doors and it was just insane. People would just jam in and
> grab LDs as if they were pieces of gold. There'd be pallets with stacks of
> titles like the various Star Trek series LDs, box sets like the "Amadeus"
> and "Platoon"sets, just thousands of Pioneer produced or pressed titles
> discounted up to 90% off retail.

I used to be jealous of those who lived in California when I'd read
about those sales here (although as I recall, Pioneer did have a couple
of mail-order sales as well, but the bulk of the real deals went to
those who were close enough to attend the in-person sales). But that was
before Laser Exchange started blowing out huge stocks of MGM laserdiscs,
first at 50% off, then later at $10-15 a pop.

After a slow start, Warner's now doing a pretty good job of getting
catalog titles out on DVD, but there are still a bunch of fairly obscure
films released by MGM on LD (when Turner still owned that part of the
Warner catalog) that probably aren't going to show up on DVD for quite a
while. Some of those MGM discs that I got for $10 are now pretty scarce
and go for considerably more than that when they show up on eBay.

Speaking of Laser Exchange, I hadn't looked at their website in quite a
while, but it appears that in their later incarnation as Playback
Trading, they're almost totally out of the LD business - they hardly
have any LDs listed for sale on their site now. Too bad, I'll always
remember them fondly.

Dave

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.laserdisc (More info?)

What was the original standard price of LDs anyway? I never had a laserdisc
player back when they were actually kind of popular, but I recall seeing
pretty high prices in the stores. Can't remember specifics.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.laserdisc (More info?)

Mark,i have to agree with you that LD's have an edge over dvd's when
we're talking audio.I've been into LD since the inception of AC-3 which
is Dolby Digital.That was the highlight for LD and the only way to get
that form of audio for our home theater until dvd was introduced.

That too was an expensive format at least for me at the time.The first
dvd players to be sold were in the $800 or more price range.I have heard
about laser rot but fortunately for me(knock on wood) I have not had any
problems so far with my LD collection.Long live laserdisc!

 

[TB]

Archived from groups: alt.video.laserdisc (More info?)

"LunarJetman1970" wrote:

(snip)
>
> On a seperate note, and only owners of Analogue PAL Laservision 1980's
> discs will probably know, as I've never seen an NTSC one go the same
> way -What causes some of the discs to go a bronzey colour and get
> mottled 'watermarks' under the disc surface? A lot of these look
> absolutely sh*te but still play!

My original pressing of "Greystoke" developed severe "bronze" spotting on
one of the discs on the first side about a year after I bought it in the
late 80's and it was pretty much the absolute definition of what laser rot
was. The disc became unwatchable and the disc itself looked like it had a
skin disease. I kept it simple to show people that yes, laser rot isn't a
fantasy, it (did) happen.

I also have a few CDs pressed in Europe in the mid 80's that also developed
rot. No spotting, but they gradually turned a bronze/copper color 'til they
almost looked like those expensive Mobile Fidelity Gold Discs - they just
couldn't be played anymore.

Basically, any kind of 'disc" media including dvds that uses a
metal/aluminum thin plate to hold the data and is laminated with a plastic
material via glue bonding could be susceptible to "rot" due to bonding
compound contamination either through dust or moisture in the air at the
factory during the production process or because the bonding compound isn't
chemically correct.

T.B.

 

[Greg]

Archived from groups: alt.video.laserdisc (More info?)

DTS on laserdisc is at a rate 1235kbps, not the 1509 that was found on
early DTS dvd's. The AC-3 bitrate for laserdisc is at 384kbps. PCM
tracks are around 1411kbps.

Greg


Nitehawk^ wrote:
> Yes, the audio was a huge highlight of LD's, DTS especially with its
> 1509 kbps soundtrack.
> Does anyone know what the AC-3 bitrate on LD's is? or how I can
> determine that?
> I know that DVD uses 768 for DTS, at least I am not aware of any
other
> bitrates on DTS DVD's with the very rare exception of some full
> bitrate DTS DVD's released back in 1999. And AC3/ Dolby Digital is
> 448 kbps (some are 384) on DVD.
> How about Dolby Surround? what bitrates were used on LD?
>
> Ed
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, 2 Mar 2005 14:57:59 -0500, mitech@webtv.net wrote:
>
> >Mark,i have to agree with you that LD's have an edge over dvd's when
> >we're talking audio.I've been into LD since the inception of AC-3
which
> >is Dolby Digital.That was the highlight for LD and the only way to
get
> >that form of audio for our home theater until dvd was introduced.
> >
> >That too was an expensive format at least for me at the time.The
first
> >dvd players to be sold were in the $800 or more price range.I have
heard
> >about laser rot but fortunately for me(knock on wood) I have not had
any
> >problems so far with my LD collection.Long live laserdisc!
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.video.laserdisc (More info?)

Yes, the audio was a huge highlight of LD's, DTS especially with its
1509 kbps soundtrack.
Does anyone know what the AC-3 bitrate on LD's is? or how I can
determine that?
I know that DVD uses 768 for DTS, at least I am not aware of any other
bitrates on DTS DVD's with the very rare exception of some full
bitrate DTS DVD's released back in 1999. And AC3/ Dolby Digital is
448 kbps (some are 384) on DVD.
How about Dolby Surround? what bitrates were used on LD?

Ed




On Wed, 2 Mar 2005 14:57:59 -0500, mitech@webtv.net wrote:

>Mark,i have to agree with you that LD's have an edge over dvd's when
>we're talking audio.I've been into LD since the inception of AC-3 which
>is Dolby Digital.That was the highlight for LD and the only way to get
>that form of audio for our home theater until dvd was introduced.
>
>That too was an expensive format at least for me at the time.The first
>dvd players to be sold were in the $800 or more price range.I have heard
>about laser rot but fortunately for me(knock on wood) I have not had any
>problems so far with my LD collection.Long live laserdisc!
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

 

[TB]

Archived from groups: alt.video.laserdisc (More info?)

"half_eaten" wrote:

> What was the original standard price of LDs anyway? I never had a
> laserdisc
> player back when they were actually kind of popular, but I recall seeing
> pretty high prices in the stores. Can't remember specifics.

Single disc titles usually listed at about $24.99 to $34.99. LDs that were
2 disc titles ran about $34.99 to $49.99. Criterion 2 and 3 disc CAV titles
almost always ran $99.99 to $124.99. Typical box sets with 3 or 4 discs ran
anywhere from $49.99 to usually around $99.99 and up to around $129.99.
Many classical music box sets ran even more. Extravagant box sets like the
original Star Wars CAV set ran $249.99.

Most single disc Japanese import LDs ran about $79.00 to $99.00 and many of
the lavish Japanese tv series box sets ran upwards of $500.00 for say, half
a season of "Lost In Space.

On of the first laserdiscs I bought (and still have) was the 1st pressing of
the Criterion 2 disc box set of "King Kong" from Ken Cranes (when they ahd a
store in the Westminster Mall) for $74.99 back in mid '85.

T.B.